#1203 - Eric Weinstein

The Joe Rogan Experience #1203 - Eric Weinstein

November 15, 2018

Eric Weinstein is a mathematician and economist, and he is also the managing director at Thiel Capital.

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ladies and gentlemen

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folks people or organisms that understand my words there's three new Netflix specials out they should be aware of what number one Joey Diaz has a Netflix special out right now called the degenerates there's a series of them also our friend Christina pazsitzky has one she has two special she has that one and she is one that she did I think like a year ago less than a year ago either call The Mother Superior and I have one out too it's called strange times and I think it's my best one they're all out right now on Netflix this episode of the podcast is brought to you by the cash app and you might already know the cash app of the number one finance app on the App Store but it also is a lot of other cool shit first of all you can direct deposit your paycheck right into the app and then you get a thing called the cash card to cash card is the only debit card that will offer you instant rewards and comes packed with

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this episode of the podcast features my good friend Eric Weinstein he is legitimately one of the smartest people I've ever met and confusingly smart to fucking smart and boy I'll tell you right now we went into the weeds he was explaining some Physics stuff that both me and Jamie took our stupid faces and and ship them back and forth and try to just try to knock some sense in there but we talked about a lot of other stuff that's right. Just about me and you probably smarter than me you'll be able to handle this physics stuff I was there was several moments where I was lost I was just hoping we're going to see a light at the end of the tunnel

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but he's awesome I really love him I love talking to him please give it out to the Great and Powerful mr. Eric Weinstein

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The Joe Rogan Experience

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and where life are you going to update the people out there know how you shut your phone off while your professional everything it's all pretty weird that there is very weird out there we were just talking about how weird it is out there before the podcast about how it just seems like it's very difficult to keep together during these times into to keep it reasonable position and to handle all the pressure of all the people that get upset at anything you do left or right in the middle Centrist your two sensors to two left you to write your unreasonable you're too reasonable you're too nice not nice enough I feel like I'm in a marriage

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doesn't seem like it does I think that this is why I dismiss is the area for disagree ability if you're not easily swayed Because You Were Somehow and sensitive enough to just want to keep the first principles where there it is that you believe that seems to be the best hedge against getting swept up in The Madness of others house oh well I guess when I go metacognitive I look at my yearning for group belonging and then I also watch my inability to belong to groups that say crazy things and so those are those are two conflicting feeling I think sometimes when people look at me they say wow you're really contrarian and you have an easy time standing up to you know the conventional wisdom I don't think it's it's that true I just think when those two things fight inside me dialectically the disagree ability is so strong because it's protecting a comprehensive view of the world and so since everything already

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kind of fits together fairly well I would say I'm much it's much harder to sway me because the number of things I would have to move cognitively to accommodate a wrong idea is quite large it seems unnecessary but it also seems like we should be able to disagree on things and you should be able to point out with reasonable courtesy that there's something wrong with someone's idea and it not become a big personal thing but often times it's not the case well

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so a lot of the things I think the word were exploring or what I would think of this caristix they're sort of rules of thumb that work fairly well within some tomato definition and we've gotten so many of these conflicting rules I meet the rules of thumb themselves conflict so for example he who hesitates is lost conflicts with nothing ventured nothing gained or something like that it's the cautionary aphorism and then there's the be bold aphorism and so we don't have a good way of sorting out conflicts that occur at the heuristic level then you also have your wrist sticks meant for social cohesion conflicting with ground truth so this is why biology is always controversial because biology is a science that tells us many of the things that we wish were true or just not true you know I always think about Ben Shapiro's facts don't care about your feelings will biology cares

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feelings it just laughed at them and Stomps on them to make them you know feel very sad but also trying to explain your feelings too but you're right exactly but you know if you really understand biology the world is so dark and it's so interesting and beautiful and in crazy that is very hard to recover simple ideas about how people should be once you really realize that are being Apes has deep, yeah I have a very minimal understanding of biology but in that understanding I've come to accept some things just about being a person that I never considered before like that all the different things that are running your decision-making like just were talking about like the need to be in a group and all these are probably evolutionary advantages to you know fostering tribal Behavior so you can all work together and feed each other you know this is always pulling at you and you know when when people give people hard time about virtue signaling it is kind of gross

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when someone virtue signal so you know but we understand what it is it's gross because we've all done it right that's one of the gross things about it when someone is just like really trying hard to act like you know they're disgusted by the way people behave because they would never behave like that I just want to let you know I'm above this type of behavior what's most likely because they weren't above that kind of behavior at some point in their life or they're not currently really about that type of behavior but they wish they were or the part of the speaking is the part that's above that behavior but that's not the part that's going to be operative after 11 on a weekend at a bar yeah three shots in all bets are off right heels or off the wagon but I think we don't we don't see ourselves we are permanently in our own blind spot because the part of us that is that you know just and righteous and good seems to know very little about the other part what's also this thing this need to belong and need to be accepted like we work to be accepted instead of work to

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someone that you would want to be a part of the group instead of being like really honest about who you are and how you think and how you behave and how you operate in the world instead of doing that trying to prove pain that you try to project an image of this here's a question for us why is vice signaling so much more powerful than purchasing Vice signaling like a person who admits their problems like an alcoholic who steps up and says I've got a real issue could be that way or could be sort of Dan Bilzerian type by signaling like you don't know what I'm into I'm into hot chicks weed and guns and I love you tons and tons of money and showing it off but he's super honest right now that's one of the reasons and you he's bulletproof in that regard but you can't fuck with him like you can't say hey look at you you're just a Playboy he like

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yeah like girls get works yeah what else bro I'm nice like he's nice guy talk to Dan Bilzerian he's friendly he's not bad guy no I mean this post which was he was I think offering a hand to a woman of Astaire and it said that come with me I'll ruin your life but it'll be fun secret to your success which is that you're a nice guy you're really into fighting you hunt elk you're clear about which ones you're going to kill which ones you want based on the reproductive cycle your ear promoting all sorts of things that people don't want to talk about to a fairly conscious level and it's produced an incredible level of trust in an era where all of the virtue signaling gives away a name if you scratch any person enough below the surface you're going to see that they're really warning you about themselves and so the people who are the

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most sort of self-critical and then this is like the only thing I brought this up recently on Twitter about meta honesty where there was in the Castro in San Francisco there was a a bar restaurant that was advertising free food naked servers plus false advertising and as a result you know you had an instant desire to to eat there and trust them so I think that in this world a virtue signaling Vice signaling is really the growth industry and that's that's what's working for good people because they are more in touching you know they are going to lie to you and they're going to do all the self-interested things but they're not going to surprise you quite as much why do you I don't think that's what he's doing I think what he's doing is living like a guy who's got a hundred million dollars and happens to be 35 years old and likes to bang hot chicks and fly around and private jet

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living some fucking house it is. He just bought some crazy house in like Bel-Air I guess what that weed money Jesus he's got. It looks like you probably cost a hundred million dollars or something ridiculous like that it's a fucking insane house but that's what he likes you know the guy likes to drive around Ferraris and but he's a nice guy so it's like we're what's what's wrong with this picture what's wrong with this picture is he's doing things that this is his house what in the holy fuck is that is yellow golf courses roof what is that this is fucking ridiculous house look at this place he gives his address out says address it's pretty hard to hide that thing why the fuck would you give his address Alex I don't think you can get there this is what he likes but it why is that bad I mean we only have a hundred years if everything goes perfect I know what do you give a shit but they do give a shit they give a shit a lot because for a lot of folks that are

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working you know making a good living making me on 50 Grand a year whatever that's completely out of the realm of possibility I wouldn't be sustainable for them and I get everybody Stone and then you take them to fire automatic weapons out of the desert oh yeah that's real risk and also the gambling he does a lot of like crazy gambling but this is the thing about the the relationship with the unforgiving this is partially why you're UFC and Jiu-Jitsu life is that when you have a relationship with the unforgiving you can say you know that guy doesn't really know what he's doing but then you're you're in the ring you know you're the man in the arena and and you find out very quickly whether or not the trash-talking you know paid off for didn't and I think that many people have no relationship with the unforgiving I can take them out on a hike into another let's say the Trinity Wilderness and then 2 hours in love to sit down and say I want to go home where I am thinking like

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okay you're you're signaling something but there's there's no car service and there's more not calling helicopter you know it just that there's this if you live in the social layer you're surprised by the existence of The Unforgiven

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I want on one hand I want to support people's ability to do whatever the fuck they want I'm one hand I want to support someone to bility to sit in front of a computer and

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whether you're working with your writing cold or you're writing a script or you're just fucking playing video games at I want to support your ability to do whatever you want to do with your families on starving is what you enjoy doing what do I care but it as a person who's experienced a fair amount of adversity especially self-imposed adversity I would I would tell you that you would benefit from it I've benefited from it and I think you'd benefit from it to you don't want to be that guy the two hours into the hike says I want to go home you don't want to be that guy you want to be that person just says well this is what we're doing and I'm going to figure out how to do this and I'm going to show character and I'm going to I'm going to be proud of myself at the end of this I mean I might have to walk for 6 hours and when it's all over my legs might be shaky and I might have to sit down but that Gator is going to taste so good it's going to be like the greatest Gatorade of all times he's going to drink anyway like in the shit out of this you're going to feel it and I think

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we learn about ourselves through especially southwell any kind of adversity you know look I'm coming off of being evacuated from the fires which was for me not that difficult you know I'm not poor I got a hotel I brought my family to the hotel we got safe got my dog to the to the podcast studio and everybody's all right you know but for those firefighters I mean 12 hour shifts battling the blaze for people who lost their home some of them try to save it was a story about a guy in Malibu the climbing on top of the roof of the hose and try to fight off the fire and get severe burns and he's in the hospital and it's raining Ash and an empty chunks of fucking fire on people Embers they're falling from the sky in this guy's trying to save his house I mean that guy literally went through the fires he'll be a different person after this no question we've been in something of a reality drought the number of people who have very little relationship

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to reality I mean you know I used to live in Cambridge Massachusetts and you come in from Boston and they would be the science of fresh killed chicken like no bones about it man fresh killed chicken but like chicken McNuggets nobody quite knows what what part of the chicken is a McNugget right it's just um abstraction that comes to you and so I think we've gotten very divorce they're all of these layers of indirection between us in the world and when a fire happens it's so overwhelming we were just joking on that the SF smoke in the Bay Area there's it it it just it gets real after having been on wheel for a very long time it's unavoidable it makes you it makes you Buck up like you got to get out of there like we got evacuated Thursday at 2:30 in the morning we were looking up like we got to get the fuck out of here I get it I don't give a shit what you leave behind just go keep your body and go everything else it's either reply

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Savoy you don't really need it that much anyway just fucking get out of there and when you see that fire raging over those Hills and helicopters dropping water on it and then another house explodes cuz the gas line gets hit it's just you you I saw that you see that you go Ojo there's there's not enough people in the world to save you there's not enough fucking firefighters or cops there's too many houses is too many people and a bunch of these houses are going to go you got to get the fuck out of there and but there's a certain

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I was with the a bunch of my friends from my neighborhood and my friend Tom Segura and his wife we all stay at the same hotel and we felt it was like a tangible sense of community but this is that I love this point let's imagine you go for a wedding and they house you with your third cousin people you barely know if you're lucky enough that the sewage system breaks and like stuff is leaking out of the ceiling and you guys all have to do heroic crazy stuff to save the house you're going to be closer to your third cousin then you are going to your Uncle Brian and this is just very strange feature of the world that is kind of a random arrival of diversity is very often would Bond you to some particular human being and if you avoid adversity in groups your whole life you probably don't realize that you're never fully

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activated as a human being typically you know if if men I think don't form groups that in some sense fight or battle that can test together so there's this very weird fact that apparently humans are the only species that organize contest in teams in this is an intrinsic feature of Being Human on tests do other animals have any contests just have to spar hips don't think that they practice it was like okay your red team champion team chimp what were the only ones that do stuff like that that can communicate right like dolphins can communicate but they don't do stuff like that right or you have individual sparring like you ought to Bear's learning to play with each other because it's safer to play with your brother in childhood then it is to just suddenly show up against them big ass

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Barron have to compete for female I had William Von hippel on a couple days ago and he's the author of the social leap and we were actually talking about this about one of the things that made human being successful as we came down from the trees and started walking around the grasslands is our ability to organize and to work and coordinate together yeah yeah I like African wild dogs are fairly good at this and you watch what they do in their spare time very often to just take the piss out of each other so that they actually come to each other's age 8 at a very high level in times of need but like you know when you're just hanging out around the fire hose at Firehouse you're really just giving each other shit all the time and so there's something about the way in which we play

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I'm being kind of Divergent from the way in which we behave when we actually just need each other and like you you need to be on that line and let's say you know throwing burlap bags and I just need you to do that thing and we're both facing something together doesn't know it doesn't have to be fighting it in the militaristic Since the situation but I do think that

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this is one of the weird things that's going on with all of this emphasis on care and feelings is that often men need to give each other shit in order to form very deep bonds I can't tease you right if I don't know where the line is like there is this line which is like dude that was way too far right we all know that those lines exist to meet you sometimes have to go up to them and see if the experiment by going over them but if somebody says I don't like the way your talking it seems very insensitive and my responses while you're going to keep me from forming a deep bond that person you just don't know that that's how we do it yeah there's shielding that they're putting up the shield rent and often is did you know to project a certain image to you they did what they did they did they want to be taken seriously they want some respect they can't deal with your goofing on them

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that's true in goofing can go wrong but it but I think that one of the things that I've been fascinated by is where did all this madness come from and I increasingly I'm wondering whether comes from social and emotional learning that started to be taught in schools around emotional intelligence so this whole idea of EQ I think had a lot to it but not all the bugs were worked out because a lot of things that

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kind of are in the neighborhood of bullying might be actually intimacy building right and so if something turns into some super disgusting deadly hazing ritual we all say what the hell are you people doing but on the other hand if it's sort of three clicks back from that line and it's another with mild discomfort me we can really ate at each other a little bit and now we're friends for life then you're the fear of The Hazing ritual gone wrong may actually stop people from Ever actually making the really deep bonds to last left waist I like everything else some people are good at things and some people suck at it so some people are good at being silly with their friends and some people go to farming you you've experienced that like I've had friends who experienced that where they do a podcast on the podcast a fuck with each other and I'll have someone come up to them that they don't even know right off the street and immediately say something like ruthlessly insulting to them and I like what the fuck and hell yeah

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how you do that show me podcast all the time like okay you're doing it wrong I don't know you we're not friends we're not bonding hear you walking up and saying something mean calling someone a fatso or actually yeah it's like didn't just not good at it and often times that's a some sort of a sign of social intelligence a lack of social intelligence a lack of I mean who knows what's going on in their home that might just be bad information from parents and they're they're growing up in this environment of just very low level social skills and now what we're doing is Matt I think that that you're spot-on we're now going to try to readjust everyone around our weakest players right so now the ideas that because that can be said in a horrible way we're not going to let anyone say anything remotely adjacent to it yeah you can't do anything that would be a precursor to it so you're just going to say well you see that little patch of bad cells over there were going to cut off your leg in order to stop that cancer and she's like

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can we do something a little bit more surgical well then also there's some things that you're there's a reason why we have is in-state the mock things because people get out of line then they demand too much goddamn attention and are they become a problem and this is a I think I believe this goes back to hunting parties and hunter-gatherers with the one person who just wanted too much attention with you you're fucking up for this group effort and that's kind of what happened socially when people claim these very ridiculous victim status it says there's a picture that I put up on my Instagram a couple weeks ago of this guy he had this crazy makeup on and he had this ridiculous description of himself like non-binary queer that also identifies as a Muslim and he was talking about quantum physics and quantum physics got to help him appreciate his queerness and I looked at that I said okay maybe or maybe you just fucking crying out for attention and all I wrote was make sense definitely doesn't seem crazy

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and people got mad at me for that for something so obvious I looked I just peered into the fucking deep dungeon that is the comment section for a moment and I saw people like you would think that the people that are most susceptible to Suicide you would leave them alone but your cruelty is your exposing your cruel to like to listen that's silly I need better friends and your friends are you going to tell you you're silly but crazy makeup ever seen Scott and look at this

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I British Iraqi gay non-binary and also identifies Muslim listen you need too much goddamn attention that's all I'm saying I'm not saying you're a bad person you should kill yourself you shouldn't be queer be whatever you want to be but if you're going that hard. Hard to Define yourself like that is Media shit that's fucking annoying your point your point is that you have to titrate the negative feedback yes what you did was you gave him a small dose and saying what

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what you might want to course correct a little bit the idea that there's any course Corrections you're not sitting there celebrating this right well that's that's the thing you're supposed to celebrate it I'm supposed to celebrate so many things yeah well you know what you can celebrate it that's okay but you shouldn't get mad if I go that might be a little nuts cuz it's obviously a little nuts it's a little nuts to paint your face with glitter is a little nuts it's a little not so that was just a regular person who's like high werecat JCPenney my name is Wendy and this is what I like to wear my face like okay when he's a crazy bitch look at Wendy go look at my face I don't know man she's a fucking crazy glitter and her hair is 15 different colors have this weird thing which I thought sometimes is called Makayla phobia the fear of Cosmetics lips

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sometimes it looks somewhat normal and then suddenly doesn't integrate and the person just looks like they've been crazy stuff stuck to their head you got some crazy stuff stuck here well that's how I perceive it now here's the question I can't be in touch by the campy Eric's got a problem with Makayla phobia I never heard that word it's a freak me out it has to be of a phobia that it has to be Eric can't accept people who wear makeup and my question would be from first principles how do you tell who to have sympathy with because it has been somewhat debilitating for me really so it's been a real issue like you've struggled with it. We have you struggled with the feeling or start with the fact that you have everybody actually Experian if you remember Tammy Faye Bakker right so she was famous for freaking people out because she had no concept of how much hang up is too much is too much you know now what if somebody looks

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normal and then you turn around and suddenly there Tammy Faye Bakker and you never can predict when that's going to happen if that's like an interesting question about do we accept the person who I don't know why I have this is just something in my mind because you're a logical person and you're looking at this war paint the people putting on and you don't understand the desire to do this why do understand you do but you don't understand actually doing it I don't understand why it looks normal like I have the feeling that to other people it looks very different than the way it looks to me will there just accepted it may be accepted and then suddenly it's like you're shaking out of the movie when you see a movie where the sum of the mic is visible from the top. It's a movie it's a movie yeah and and that but anyway we all have these weird quirks the question is with whom should we be sympathetic

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and with whom do we do we say well you're being judgemental with me it's women's shoes that have gigantic heels the stilettos they could barely walk in that one freaks me out it freaks me out cuz I see women walking and I'm like this is so crazy this is a choice that you are I mean I can't imagine I'm paranoid I guess maybe I've seen too much physical conflict I can imagine wearing something that would physically compromise me to the point where I literally can't run away cuz you can't run away in those things as you're in like stilettos like these little things that you walk around in and your feet are all smooshed in you basically doing tiptoes everywhere you go and fuck each have to be killing you by the other night right you're not running away does a wolf chasing you or some shit there's something going down you're not you're not getting away it's just it's a weird like the desire to lengthen your legs and to give this graceful appearance called lordosis Behavior lordosis lordosis so much today

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high heels were originally developed for men to appear taller not sure if what if you're taller only or if it was for writing I can't remember the last people don't know cowboy boots the reason why they slip on like that is when the the horsebox and takes off your boots fall off their supposed to I didn't know that's the whole idea behind the reason slip-on slip off and they have that he'll that he'll slips into the stirrups so when you get when the horse bucks you don't want to get dragged son you want to that chick just fly all right and then you're on your back on that horse go then you go pick up your boots cuz they falling off and the fucking horses gone but at least you're alive that's it expression he died with his boots on you yet if you get well not really I think that's like a gunfight talk to you but I think if you could drive me the a drag courses are going to run over rocks and shit you're done to people die all the time that are wearing regular shoes that shoved

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feet in the stirrups and then you're stuck that's why cowboy boots come off like that. I remember when I used to ride horses we have the guy with leading the trail would like take us up to a gallop and Sunnyside emergency was really terrifying yeah and you know you have to do it at speed very very quickly but I think that high heels got taken over by women because a lot of the things that we claim that we like about heels that is the ideal weight for height I like the way it makes the leg look probably secondary to the curvature of the back and the way in which that is typically associated associated with the sexual receptivity posture the deal connotes and so the way I read it is that the cost of the heel is part of the communication in other words I'm willing to do something that is clearly not comfortable or for my benefit in any other way so much so that you can tell that I must be

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interested in sending a signal but you have to deny the signal to sew part of the signaling is to say these are actually my most comfortable shoes they always say that girls are hilarious they're so comfortable these are so comfortable right like how is that even possible those aren't Crocs yes but but the deception has to be part of

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and now I'm like picturing Crocs with heels

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that was really weird well the deception has to be you have to you have to decide that you're not ridiculous it's a shared deception yes cuz this is the guy I have to say that's so interesting yeah but that's a lie overall line but it's mutually understood as a line yeah but when the girls are sitting

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girls could say these are so comfortable because they're not killing them because they've accepted a higher level of pain tolerance with Footwear than men have like if I had just Jam my feet into something pointy and some pointy ass Spanish dancer type shoes and it would hurt after while we're time I want the kind of uncomfortable thing that we do to ourselves as men I think since then but very rarely rarely kill you pretty easily with that I like if someone has a tie on and I grabbed a hold of Ty boy unless you're a lot bigger than me I might kill you

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got a hold your tie ties a hard thing to shake loose it's really strong like you could you a good ties not going to rip someone gets ahold of your tie at the not yet just twists and holds onto you all have to do is hold on to you grab an arm and just wrap your legs around you and hold on to that Thai you're a dead man your dad that you're giving them a weapon yellow you all the time are you convinced me no more ties grab that and just fucking twist you don't have much time then you don't have much time to get this arm off your next to get such a UFC you get to spend his UFC don't wear clothes but they should be able to grab hold of someone's clothing like like a person with a leather jacket if you're talkin shit and you have a leather jacket on your with a guy who knows Judo yeah you are Beyond fucked you don't have this this guy might as well have cannons coming out of his body with your ear doomed your hundred percent Doom is going to grab that leather jacket in Bay City has handles

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throw you up in the air and he's going to hit you with the world the whole world is below and he's going to drive you into the world and you're so fucked and you don't even realize it

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Jehovah you end up in fist fights never never man I don't know what I don't have nothing to do with that I just get away I would never want to get in a fist fight the world gets always talking about fighting and what can happen but just like almost none of this in you know relatively boring white guy middle-aged never grown WorldStarHipHop that shit's all day everyday there's plenty of videos most of time nothing happens but the one time when she does happen if you don't know what how to defend yourself you're really fucked this is this is true but then the thing is is that in all the practicing that you do you're also exposing yourself to the potential for injury oh yeah so there's a question as to whether you're safer

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if you spend all of your time in this kind of well what if something happens I want to be prepared but the preparation for it is it South potentially fairly hazardous that's unquestionable but isn't that just like the guy who sits on the couch never goes into the woods cuz he doesn't want to get tired I know it's very similar cuz like yeah we are I'm 51 years old and I'm in and it all works. So even though I've been injured I'm right here everything works out of shit fixed what if the UFC thing was like bold and interesting when you were young guy do you think you would have I would have a hundred percent done it and I probably would have a much harder time having this conversation that's right yeah for sure yeah you really know what you're talking about and you're getting front row seat not actually having to have your brain particulate take the pound and there's no getting away from that is that is the unfortunate reality that every fighter accepts there is no getting away from that there's there's an

► 00:38:57

absolute possibility and it's not just your head it's also your joints the big part is your back and your neck I know many guys that have neck impingement SanDisk herniation and fused neck discs and then nerve-pinched where their nerves are impinged to the point where they have atrophy in their arms I know several guys who have that would have one arm that's smaller than the other arm and it's severely impedes our ability to move and they used to be world champions two guys that have been on the show bus route and Pat miletich to the greatest of all-time both guys have a small one small arm and one regular sized arm cause of neck impingement for their nerves are literally pinched down by all the swelling and scar tissue in the damage discs yeah but since we became friends I started just casually looking at this world and it's utterly fast I mean there's there's nothing like it well did you Jitsu world I think you would there's there's 2 different world

► 00:39:57

writers the MMA World which incorporates all the different martial arts and then there's do Jiu Jitsu world and the Jitsu world I think you would find out yes you would love it because it's basically what you call a chess is not quite fair right because it's more complex than Jess is much more going on he's afraid of her so high but it's also easier to win if someone's better than chest so cute even if someone is fairly confident test will take a few moves to beat them and Jiu-Jitsu of someone's fairly confident the other one is a master it probably crush your very quickly on but the when you watch too really high level guys trying to say have you tried the rabbit's ass crazy rolling exercising leverage in position and in the knowledge of moves that Eddie Bravo vs. yams hard even know what's going on it's crazy if you don't know it's one of my more difficult challenges of being in a commentator is when the fight goes to the ground explaining to people

► 00:40:57

watch it home what you want to do right now to get his right leg over his arm and as soon as he does that now that arm is stuck he's in trouble right now you know I'd like to try to explain that to people so they can follow along back excited about this is like really complicated like he's got there's like a dance he's doing the other guys try to resist the damn some I saw the Gracie breakdown of particular fights were they committed to memory every move yeah I agree playing great games of like morphe or chest and you just thinking wow there's the Evergreen game are the immortal game and that that to me is fast 8 but it's actually more interesting to me in the UFC

► 00:41:42

Arena because of the fact that that's only component and that it's the what I didn't understand was how much we could get close to unrestricted fighting and still have people fairly dependably survived with minimal obvious this big disfigurement if we limited weight cutting the weight-cutting is the number one health issue in the sport in my opinion is number 2 is the brain damage and the impact and that you no broken bones things along those lines but the number one is weight cutting because it's so unnecessary it's such a such an issue that needs to be addressed cuz he's guys want to compete at the highest weight possible so you know how it works no okay see if you were going to compete in the 170 lb division but you actually weighed 190 what you do is you would wait until you would follow pretty strict diet keep your body weight in your fat a certain level and then when it comes down to a few days before you would dehydrate yourself pretty radical and then

► 00:42:42

rehydrate yourself scientifically using the correct is a bunch of guys like George Lockhart guys who are experts in this and then they give you the exact right amount of nutrients right amount of potassium and Zane can they want to replenish all of your electrolytes and get you in a perfect balance but you're still compromise and if you don't have a guy like a George Lockhart or someone is a real expert in nutrition and understands biology and can get you back into that position you're most likely going to compete compromised but you can accept that significant compromising because you're going to be a bigger person than the person you're fighting but they also like in boxing in particular the vast majority of deaths have occurred in the lighter weight divisions and a lot of it is not just because of the head trauma that because it's head trauma to someone is dehydrated it sucks and it's it's contrary to what martial arts is supposed to be about martial arts supposed to be about skill for skill it's not supposed to be but cheating and the cheating thing is like you're dehydrating yourself it's like sanction cheating you're saying you're 170 lb

► 00:43:42

you like you said the 170 pound champion and get on the scale 193 the fox going on this is frustrating if I want to meet you in a different class like I wanted to fight you my whole life but we're really separated but you can lose weight the right way looking so he wants to compete at 170 lb in my humble opinion they should actually weigh 170 pounds is a ultra marathon runner and one of the things that he does when he gets ready for Ultra marathons is he lose his body weight but he has to have any body weight to lose so he'll he'll burn 3000 calories and eat 2000 calories and that's how he loses weight he lets his body eat itself so he gets down to the 160s and that's when he runs his gigantic long race is like 240 miles but I know he's done this you can do this like you don't have to dehydrate choose to dehydrate themselves because they replenish and then they get much bigger when they get inside the Octagon when he's 165 is actually 165 that's just what he weighs and that's the best way to run 240 miles so he

► 00:44:42

did you discipline but these guys that are doing it and it's not their fault because it's already been established it's a part of the sport it's been there for years and years and years and it's it's sanctioned cheating and everybody does it and it's the worst part of the sport because it's really damaging to your kidneys terrible for your organs in your body starts to shut down when you do it too often your body doesn't want to lose weight anymore so it starts to really hold on to that water and guys fall asleep and pass out bang their heads off walls and fight get cancelled like proflex championship-level flights get cancelled cuz got blackout and cracked her head off the wall misses this is happened in the in the UFC before it's just super super unnecessary and unfortunate and part of it is because there's not enough weight classes is like you know there's one 55 minutes 170 the difference between 155 and 170 is not just 15 pound cuz if you actually weigh 155 and it's guys dropping down to 170 that motherfucker could be 190

► 00:45:42

and he's just figuring out a way to cut weight to get down to there and that happens all the time so you're you're dealing with you nobody could be 25-30 pounds difference between you two guys if you're if you actually weigh with the weight classes when you get into the Octagon so people are forced to drop way they're forced to go lower they want to compete at a world-class level they're forced to take this extra risk and it could be mitigated it could all be stopped by hydration test the did the UFC can step in all the athletic commission can step in and say enough is enough you're going to fight it what you weigh and we will give you more weight classes so you can figure out what's the wait for you to be best at and I hope it doesn't take someone dying before they figure this out because it's one of those things that people have done like circumcision they've done it in forever so they just keep doing it but if they just started doing it tomorrow people be like why did you cut that baby's dick

► 00:46:36

are you fucking crazy but I've always cut baby's dick so I've been cutting baby's dicks for years like this is right until you get used to it while it's like practiced across the board under the guise of being sanitary prevention of AIDS only stupid reasons to cut dicks but really it's just a tradition that doesn't make any goddamn sense that's on the best analogy to weight cutting throughout the posted

► 00:47:07

pick up on an analogy with you so when you're trying to describe the ground game yeah it's super tough for a lay audience because the picture doesn't necessarily match what you're seeing because the level of expertise makes a bunch of random arm movements and in head movements and hip movements into something else we have the same problem in like math and physics where everybody wants to know what's going on with that thing and then when you have been listening to like the physicists on your program not to give him any mathematicians but it's so confusing and figure out how to talk to the world about things people everybody wants to know about and I was just curious if you saw a parallel in those two things those Sean Carroll is done a really good job of trying to explain things Neil deGrasse Tyson's been really good job trying to explain things but I saw it the explanation of gauge symmetry Lawrence Krauss yeah

► 00:48:07

your show which is like from my way of thinking was the most important principles in the world number one question I had I said okay I need you to explain to me what is gauge symmetry what does that mean it's so weird that he didn't I don't think he expected me to just bust it out yeah I don't think so either but I think that it's so hard

► 00:48:35

to get back to you in a few maybe but like

► 00:48:40

what people say the universe is expanding right what the fuck does that mean they're very smart person says into what right you know like it's the universe what is it expanding into Brian and where's it going right and I could it doesn't make any sense because the Linguistics of the universe is expanding is it really what the so you say in the matter in the universe is moving out words is that what the universe is expanding guns out what it means is the infinite universe is getting more infant in her know it's a container

► 00:49:18

I was trying to be silly gustativas kicking it yeah so if you think about this bottle okay right

► 00:49:26

it's the slices of the bottle that are expanding but if you think of the bottle is the universe the bottom of the bottle is expanding it's just a cross sections that are expanding and so that's what they really mean what they really mean is something that the space-time metric on space like cross-sections has its volume formula integrated is is higher something like that it's some some mathematical statement that the universe is expanding is not helpful to me like if I wasn't able to read the math I would say I don't get it why don't get anything quite honestly I'm not being self-deprecating I don't get the big bang yeah I don't get it at all if he hears what somebody should tell you okay

► 00:50:12

there are two kinds of singularities when you try to solve Einstein's field equations for Gravity so grab it is a thing Einstein tells us pretty much what we think gravity is the curvature of space and time and when we try to solve his equations we get these black hole Singularity is called Swartz Shield singularities when let me get this initial Singularity which we were so she ate back to the big bang with the Friedman Walker Roberts and model in some sent the singularities are indications to us that we're not at the end of physics in the Einstein's equations aren't aren't the real story and so rather than sort of saying they're pretty good model up until this point and then we kind of really don't know what happened then we have the observational thing that we would match the Big Bang in the me of the model think we would map to the big bang and to be honest with you we pretty sure that are models don't make sense past the point in that we're having this conversation past the point where we're pretty sure they don't make sense that would be much more honest

► 00:51:12

but because we have this desire to to blow people's minds gratuitously and everybody wants everything beginning and we are waiting room are we in we want to sort of answer more of that than we probably should that's an interesting way that makes sense. Let me give you an alternate spin on quantum mechanics so typically people say you know the mind-blowing thing that quantum mechanics is it it's probabilistic

► 00:51:46

and that is kind of mind-blowing but if you actually say differently you say look in classical mechanics like Newton stuff that we feel more comfortable with you have good questions about questions like if you and I go hang out at the beach and I say to you hey where is that waived concentrated at what point does that wit wave live you look at me and say it's a wave it's not concentrated at a point it's all along the shore

► 00:52:15

so as a classical physicist you to say that's not a good questionnaire

► 00:52:20

and when I ask you a good question like how fast is the wave front moving in along its trajectory something you can give me an answer in the definite so as long as you asked a good question the classical mechanics you get definite answers when you go to quantum mechanics that you asked a good question technically that means that the state Vector is observable of the hermitian operator representing the question nevermind funny thing happens you get deterministic answers there's no probability involved whatsoever so if I asked a good question in quantum mechanics I have the same property that I I do when I asked you the question classical mechanics I get a definite answer there's no probability

► 00:53:03

when I ask a bad question quantum mechanics instead of like classical mechanics that says you know screw off I'm not answering that that's ridiculous it's a bad question quantum mechanics as you really want to ask me a question alright I'll give you maybe this answer and maybe that answer and here's the probability distribution that that I'll actually give you either of those two answers and what's more I'll even kick it into the state that I that you asked about so for example if you asked where is that wave concentrated so like let's say this my coffee cup and I drop a little drop in the center of it that creates a circular way that radiates out and see where is the wave concentrated well at one second and hit the coffee mug that says a big coffee cup and it one second after that it's concentrated again in the center so that becomes a good question only when the wave becomes RI concentrated in the center of the cup right but it that way were a Quantum wave I could ask where is the wave concentrated and with equal probability

► 00:54:03

suddenly the wave will concentrate at some point along the circle that represents the wave

► 00:54:11

thanks what would you answer me then what the point would be a little constipated one of these points around the circle at random with equal equal probability and suddenly the wave will concentrate randomly when it's a Quantum question so this is why quantum mechanics is so confusing quantum physics are so confusing to people while cuz they but the point of if I if I have a wave and I slow it down I can look at a wave in a coffee mug right and I can see that if I ask where is the wave concentrated you would say is concentrated it like half an inch out from the center of the cop say no no not what ring is a concentrated what exact point. Concentrated exact point but that wave in quantum mechanics which is not concentrated at an exact point behaves differently when I ask a bad question so the point that I'm trying to get across is

► 00:55:05

good questions have exactly the same properties in classical mechanics and quantum mechanics there's no introduction to probability Theory the weird question is why is quantum mechanics answering bad questions

► 00:55:18

will or maybe even weird question is

► 00:55:23

not just what it is is quantum mechanics in an adolescent state of understanding I mean is it part of the problem that they don't know enough yet and they're trying to explain what they do now what they can prove on paper and for a person like me what do you know and then like well we know probabilities we know this we know that a person like me doesn't have any studying in it just goes was what does that mean what's that that's great so like let's say we were having a conversation about genetics and we were looking only at the DNA we didn't see epigenetics in terms of like methylation pattern then you shove everything onto DNA and maybe you had no concept of like development and the model would work up to a point would explain why you have blue eyes or brown eyes but it wouldn't explain all sorts of other things and so then you over overdevelop that model so I think that what you're saying is really Einstein's intuition which is I'm not saying I unsign I'm not saying that this is wrong I'm saying this isn't

► 00:56:23

complete and then when we finally get the answer we're going to say oh that's why we used to think of it in those crazy terms so back to gauge Theory gauge symmetry what the hell is that alright well here's the here's the craziest thing okay there is a very confusing visual image of the fundamental unit that you need to appreciate what gauge symmetry is all about and I had Jamie loaded up under the tab called Planet hop and this is going to each OPF hopf what the fuck am I looking at you were looking at the most important object in the universe what

► 00:57:06

that looks like some trippy screensaver on your laptop take another puff my friend because it's worth it this is what you're looking at is a principal fiber bundle and it's because the Earth those are the continents I'm looking at that's the cool part about it which is

► 00:57:25

this is very confusing to figure out what you're looking at but it's finite another words if we stay at for an hour or two on this and we actually answer all your questions you will actually know what a principal bundle is and you will know the arena in which gauge Theory exists for folks at home they're just listening and they will what the fuck these guys talking about what is the name of this video Jamie

► 00:57:47

stop video song video of small file on a page I typed in plant Hops and it was the first thing that showed up on math. Turano. Edu okay so extended thing OPF for anybody wants to look at this if you're just listening and you have no idea why I'm freaking out this was done by the friend of mine named Roar barnatt on I actually coded the same thing up strangely enough didn't do it is brilliant the job of coloring it and it looks amazing by the way so

► 00:58:20

okay what you're looking at is a two dimensional sphere that is the surface of the Earth

► 00:58:29

where an extra Circle

► 00:58:32

is included at every point on the surface of that sphere but you're not visualizing

► 00:58:39


► 00:58:41

that extra Circle which would be called the fiber

► 00:58:46

when you take the totality of all of the circles together one for each point on the surface of the sphere

► 00:58:53

they create something called a three sphere that is all the points that are 1 unit of distance away from the origin in four-dimensional space so that three dimensional sphere is the analog of a two dimensional sphere sitting in three-dimensional space so think about a caramel apple you've ever make caramel apples you get a disc of caramel and you wrap it around the sphere that has the Apple surface right so this is the three-dimensional version of caramel wrapped around the three dimensional sphere sitting in for dimensional space now

► 00:59:33

I'm trying but look totally trippy so we're not going to get it completely during the session however I don't think so we like the time so the first thing is you are finding out that one of your friends thinks this is the most important object in the universe and you've never even heard of it right much less know that there's one visual example what the fuck I was just happening now exactly it does look fucking crazy well okay this is what was discovered in the mid-1970s as the connection between

► 01:00:13

mathematics in different where we call differential geometry and the discipline of particle theory so two guys Jim Simons the world now the world's most successful hedge fund manager in C and yang a person who might are arguably be the world's first or second greatest living theoretical physicist had a lunch seminar and this is why don't we figure out how do we talk to each other and what they found out that they both had developed version of this picture and independently independently so was the Rosetta Stone that Unleashed 2 Revolution so when Lawrence Krauss was talking to you about gauge Theory hear you saying things but chess boards and you color it white and colored black is super confusing to me I would rather your people be confused about an actual example of the object on which we do gauge theory that you can visually see right now if I started to tell you what gauge theory is

► 01:01:13

pretty simple

► 01:01:15

so here's an accurate description of never hear anyone say when you're doing differential calculus I don't know if you remember differential calculus trying to figure out the slopes of lines and brought instantaneous rise over there

► 01:01:29

so that always makes sense to people okay I figure out how fast going up versus how fast is going across

► 01:01:35

the question arises which is where do you measure the rise from the for example if I say what is the height of Mount Everest

► 01:01:45

Jamie will say 30 was 35000 yes what you thinking is I don't know I can't remember I want to say it's 35,000 what you think cuz I was 29 29029 what's the highest what's the highest one

► 01:02:10

is it okay to get your second right is it is Everest the highest yeah okay so can Everest the 29 would you say 29029 above what

► 01:02:23

c-leveled okay where is Mount Everest located in what sea it's above sea level so we start from the center of the earth we have this structure called the geoid which is the interpolation of sea level as if sea level is if the Earth was only ocean in there was no ties right and is if there is some sort of us We snuck in the reference level that's my point is is that we can teach these kids to repeat flights 29000 in change above sea level and there's no see so that reference level is the magic of Gage Theory right which is that we measure the rise of the Run based on a custom level so level that we all agree upon so for example let's imagine that you and I are in some country experiencing hyperinflation

► 01:03:14

right and I'm your boss and you say dude I need a raise I said well look I told you I would hire you for in a $10,000 a month and you say yep that's what your salary is constant I took the derivative of it I've paid you $10,000 last month 10,000 this month so you're getting the same amount derivative equal zero it's constant salary now you have to come back at me in calculus you say no I don't like your notion of the derivative because what you're doing is your measuring the absolute number of Dinars that you're paying me but what I want to do is I want to measure it in purchasing power because I'm losing money every month that you don't increase my salary so I now come up with a version of the calculus in which Mike salary is not constant because it's being measured relative to purchasing power rather than absolute units

► 01:04:09

that's gauged

► 01:04:12

is that you're bringing any reference level

► 01:04:15

that does the differentiation So you you're measuring rise over run by customizing the problem so these were two different applications of the calculus the cheating employer says I want to go with constant Dinars the gifted employee says not so fast I know gauge Theory I want to use a custom reference level which is purchasing power

► 01:04:37

right so it's like sneaking the geoid into Tibet to measure Everest I've got my custom level does this make sense to you it makes sense right but he said I do I meant. We need a new reference of what what you want to measure what would a new conversation to have a ride like a flat level it would be really safe now

► 01:05:03

maybe after we eat mushroom cap see what's up it's still in reference to quantum physics like how you would use gauge symmetry should inform what we can do linguistically so you should push everything into the visual realm that you can annoy mean by that like why I showed you the Hop vibration which is the only

► 01:05:36

in some sense the only mature picture I can show you of a principal fibration in Geometry or physics that is honest and has the full complexity it's got a certain kind of nodded this to it it's got something that we would call curvature and it is visualizing and so

► 01:05:57

it would be better that we spent you know a day or two on this most important object which we think reality is based around and that you visually got comfortable with it and then you said okay now tell me again what gauge symmetry is and then instead of Lawrence talking about this chess board in the color is all the stuff by analogy you'd actually be seeing gauge Theory visually like I could program a computer and have done so just show you visually with a gauge theory is enough take some time to start understand what the trippy pictures are beautiful let's bring up the Escher staircase

► 01:06:34

and Jamie has a nice wrinkle on this that instead of using m c Escher staircase

► 01:06:39

he's got this animated guy just keeps going down all right now what's going on with those stairs

► 01:06:46

the stairs are start of an optical illusion because obviously can't just keep going down but then you build these systems systems like rock paper scissors what's the best thing to throw in rock paper scissors well depends on what you throw well but we should be able to agree that rock is better than scissors rock is better than says in the papers better than Rock right so you go around that thing and what is it that you get to like rock is much better than Rock Britain's got that seems crazy that I can concept would be what we would call Hala know me the weird sentence rock is better than Rock because of that going around the loop rock is better than Rock I don't get it Rock and evidence scissors paper paper is better than rocks my transitivity rock is there for better than Rock because you went around the loop and came back to rock yeah yeah worth like it if you're if you're changing the currencies and you don't spend any of it because you keep you lose using your credit card by the time you come home you have more money than when you left

► 01:07:46

because the exchange rates did something so that when you changed into each currency you somehow got richer but by saying Brock is better than Rock you're denying the fact they're exactly the same but they're not you're not a dress I just want to go so the idea that this system here so those stairs in engage Theory would be these reference levels for the derivative and you can have situations where the reference levels don't knit Flatley together

► 01:08:17

right and so by virtue of that we would say that the system has curvature curvature is the Essure Ernest of of these better than Transit statements but we're looking at folks for people just listening we're looking at you never seen those Asher patches those sketches they're very strange because what there are a bunch of staircases that appear to always be going downhill even if one of them is above the other one it's very strange very strange and this one we're watching animated guy roll down the staircase constantly even though it really looks like somehow or another it must go up somewhere but you don't ever see it going up but it's also a factor of the illusion of perspective and how it's drawn and and nail playing games with lines exactly but

► 01:09:06

if you do this very weird experiment which we didn't know about until the late 50s called The Aronoff foam experiment if you run a electric current through a wire that's insulated it's it appears not to have any electromagnetic field outside of the insulation however if you do some sort of quantum interference experiment you can tell that there's current going through because it affects the phage phase shift let's say of an electron orbiting that insulated electromagnetic system so nobody thought that was going to happen because they thought will an insulator would keep it we thought the electromagnetic field is what determines the shift in the electron it's insulated there is no electromagnetic field to worry about it turned out that it wasn't the electromagnetic field alone it was some previous geometric concept which is called the electromagnetic potential that.

► 01:10:06

something about the phase shift so this extra staircase in the case of electromagnetism it's like the photons are the analog of those steps they're partially would determine the derivative operators this reference levels in again in our in our discussion of the am I paying you the right amount in hyperinflationary conomy so all of these things you're trying to figure out well that's an optical illusion that affect actually occurs and some systems not as an optical illusion yes right so this weirdness requires a fair amount in terms of either study of math or learning visualisations but there's no way to achieve it in my experience with linguistic communication like all the stuff gets said about you know the universe is expanding or let me tell you what it needs theory is and what there's a reason it's confusing it's cuz it doesn't make any acting sense

► 01:11:06

what you're saying sort of but so this is this is like what firemen said if you think you know quantum physics you don't know Quantum physical there's there's some of that like one of the most important things in the world is this thing called a spinner like the electrons in the protons correspond to things called Spinners in the average person has no idea that Spinners exist what's more Spinners have a property that when I tell it to your linguistically won't make any sense this with coffee makers perfect alright here's the problem hold you up from the bottom

► 01:11:51

and here's the first challenge without spilling it I want you and without rejecting your grip on the bottom of your cup I want you to turn your cup 360° no no sorry turn your finger should not change on the cup turn the cup 360° without spilling it and try to take set

► 01:12:16

okay that didn't work now without coming back how would you take a sip if I got it all the way around that way

► 01:12:24

jiu-jitsu man

► 01:12:30

I'll have to help you going to do it ready are you going to go around a circle

► 01:12:40

right now I'm screwed if I don't bring it back underneath so that system required 720 degrees of rotation unexpectedly you just keep going right now the idea that there are objects that don't come back to themselves

► 01:12:58

under 360 degrees of rotation but require 7:20 is probably something you never thought about before in your life but without that you wouldn't have the poly Exclusion Principle you wouldn't have the stability of matter and this thing is called the Philippine wine dance Jamie do you want to

► 01:13:16

that's not very seductive Jeff it seems like some very odd ethnic dance yeah but like maybe you could do 11th Planet Jiu Jitsu here we go

► 01:13:29

so this spinner

► 01:13:32

is one of the coolest most important objects anywhere and it was discovered to be important physics by guy named Paul Dirac

► 01:13:41


► 01:13:43

okay so this 720 Theory

► 01:13:48

is entirely responsible for the world that we live in this is so bizarre wide-open animation and nobody knows about it right like unless you're hanging out with physicists they don't tell you that electromagnetism has to do with the fact that there's a Secret Circle at every point in space and time that's invisible to you they don't tell you that there's stuff that requires 720 degrees of rotation they just say mind-blowing stuff about so what is happening in the 720 degrees of rotation in the quantum world there's an object that is requiring this just the way the cup Arm System require 720 degrees of what object is this call the spinner

► 01:14:29

and that's spinner is how we model the electron neutrino corks all that is spin Oriole matter

► 01:14:41

sir that's a good long pause I like it yeah and we're does this fit in in our model of the universe like what is the function of this why is it there what is it how do we know it's there but we know it's there because when Dirac so there was this problem with like the Schrodinger equation Schrodinger equation takes one derivative in terms of the direction of time and takes to derivative in the direction of all the spatial directions but because Einstein told us that space and time of woven together for the theory to be relativistic you need the same number of derivatives of time as of space to Space X would have one kind of semi unified object all right that means you either have to boost the number of derivatives of time up to to to to match the two derivatives in the directions of space we have to knock the to direct derivatives in the spatial directions down to one derivative to get it to be equal no one

► 01:15:41

I can get you something called the client Gordon equation with the rock did is he took a square root of the clown Gordon equation to get these Spinners we had these numbers he didn't understand at first he was going to get kicked into this world of spinners he came up with a square root equation which a x b thought to be numbers was not equal to be times that it was like equal to the negative of be times that it was like what two numbers when you multiply them matter in which order they wasn't numbers it was matrices this was one of the great insights you know arrival time Stein in terms of the depth of what a told us about the universe most of us haven't really heard of Paul to rock we don't realize that he has one of the three most important equations in physics now in when you say three most important important and how it's applicable to everyday life or important and how it's given us an understanding and quantum physics or important how it's understand it it's it's understanding is Cigna

► 01:16:41

quantum physics talk about Bedrock reality like you and I are having a conversation and if your Matrix fan and what we might call the contract okay what is the construct made of made so the way I do it is I think it was a newspaper story there's where and when did it happen

► 01:16:59

there was who and what was involved in this how and why so where and when is space and time clearly

► 01:17:07

The Who and the what to me is what's it say The Who is the spin Oriole stuff like electrons protons neutrons quarks the stuff that were made of and then you and I are only able to see each other because we're passing photons back and forth with your Force particles they're not spin or oil

► 01:17:26

stated they come back to themselves after 360 Degrees that don't require 7:20

► 01:17:32

that's so this is sort of the you know if you were going to go to a play it have the the dramatic personality the play given to you at the beginning so this is what this universe is it's a story about space and time where and where and when I'm at what is in that you know like who are the players went Quitman are they using that's like bosons it for me on and then there's a hole in the Y which is the equations in the lagrangian that govern the rules of play

► 01:18:00

and also freak xample if you and I you know start to go to the beach and we got a ball and a net and you think we're going to play volleyball and we actually send this is not over your place it packed up bro which is like volleyball played with the feet in the martial arts style she's awesome yeah we should a video on that recently soccer volleyball happening one that we should we should do this as a nation

► 01:18:29

that's a different set of rules for a ball in a net in two teams

► 01:18:34

that you could have done it one way is volleyball and you could have done it another way is CPAC Tupperware you using your feet and your hands so those that's where the breakdown would have physics theory is you got to tell me where and when you had tell me what's in the game you got to tell me what the rules are

► 01:18:52

and that's what this place is into theoretical physics

► 01:18:56

is the most interesting of all of these fields to me not because it speaks to us about our daily lives because it speaks to us about what where are we where it where is this thing taking place

► 01:19:07

so it seems to me that there's a small number of people

► 01:19:12

but that are studying this stuff that are there getting past biology the getting past

► 01:19:22

gravity climate change different variables at work constantly dealing with and they're getting to the very

► 01:19:31

things that make everything and what is it under the wiring with lift up the board what's going on in here right as I get into a computer down to the 0 and 1 right yeah so that thing

► 01:19:48

we got three or four equations we got three or four different kinds of objects in the system we seem to be and then people going to not like what I'm about to say but screw them we seem to be almost at the end like these equations are so beautiful there's so tight that it's almost most mysterious because it feels like this thing like a movie that ended prematurely House Hotel

► 01:20:16


► 01:20:18

when we found the Higgs particle at the LHC

► 01:20:23

there wasn't anything left that needed to to close to explain the system we know that there's Dark Matter out there that we don't understand you know that there's Dark Energy out there that we don't understand because of astronomical observations but all the stuff that we know about when you look at it and collided high-energy and figure out what mutates into what there's nothing missing anymore so it's like it's like

► 01:20:49

you've got this odd thing where everything got very very simple very Unified

► 01:20:55

and it felt like we were going to get one or two more giant unification the whole thing would be tied up with a bow and right now we just don't have anything that is needed to close the system so for example when you have radioactive carbon Decay what you see is that one of the neutrons flips into being a proton and it spits out an electron when it does that it sounds like the trans nucleon is the chips what it is

► 01:21:25

okay that electron doesn't carry off enough energy to explain how energy would be conserved there's something missing so this guy Wolfgang Pauli said I bet there's a particle the neutral so we can't see it that we won't leave a track in a cloud chamber it won't have any effect that we can see electromagnetically but it's carrying away some of the energy because I'm not going to give up an electron conservation of energy just because this particular process doesn't seem to conserve it sure enough there was the sneaky particle that was spiriting away some of the energy of the system that couldn't be seen because it didn't interact electromagnetically and it didn't interact one of the strong force the only thing you could use to trap it would be the weak force and the weak force was so weak that was very hard to see it

► 01:22:11

okay well there's no neutrino

► 01:22:14

that I know of left to find there's no thing that's missing in our standard model and I'm just not satisfied nobody satisfied that the play is over why would the play be over just because we've discovered all the neutrinos

► 01:22:29

well no it said we had an easy job when there was stuff that was missing then you just hypothesize I bet there's some invisible thing that scaring away some stuff let's go look for something that's hard to see so they find it they finally neutrinos they find work glue on plasma there but I was going to say that they found like matter so you and I are made out of the first generation of matter but there could be like alternate Joe Rogan it made out of 2nd generation matter or 3rd Generation we don't know of any Generations Beyond these to hold up yeah it was so like the electron okay has it has a relative called the muon

► 01:23:13

the behaves exactly like the electron except it's heavier and the up down the up and down quarks that make up protons and neutrons have relatives called strange quirks and charm corks so there's like a second copy of Lego that has all the same properties as the first copy of Lego except it's at a different math Level D answer but it's almost identical copy and nobody wanted this thing to the famous jokes there was this guy is a door Robbie was like you know kind of an ethnic Jew in in in the in New York and when they found the second generation of matter he responded as if it was a group of people at a deli and he said who ordered that you know until that like that a joke cuz that's who ordered that nobody knew there was a second generation and then like them they hit us over the head you know there's a third one too

► 01:24:00

everybody's just like what why

► 01:24:05

where do these things coming from so the fact that you don't know this like this what a profound disconnect that you're having all these physicists on the show and these are the basic secret that word world these are Rock Solid these aren't this isn't speculative Multiverse String Theory woohoo Schrodinger's cat stuff in on this is like this is ground truth and we don't know it when we don't know it because nobody will show you a picture of the Hop vibration where there's a concept called the group which is how we think about symmetry that no mathematician and physicist can you know go a day without talking about groups almost and we act as if it doesn't need to be taught in high school

► 01:24:46

like a stupid little blow your mind we're not going to teach you the groups even exist so we built the professional version of the the subject around objects that we don't even tell you exist when you're studying in school so if you think about the portal story

► 01:25:04

in child there's the story about either it's a rabbit hole or looking glass or a wardrobe or platform nine and a half or whatever these things are I don't know what the Harry Potter version of is but how do I get from the world that I'm in

► 01:25:20

to this new Amazing World and even find out that it's there and that's what I think theoretical physics is failed to do it hasn't build a portal for most people to even understand what the issues are what are the objects what is the game how close are we to understanding what existence itself is but I think we're very very close

► 01:25:39

in the square root this was I was going to say before about the rock is like the most profound object mathematics to me and the reason is that when I asked you what is the square root of -1 that is a question that can be posed entirely within the familiar so the real the real numbers you're comfortable you know you owe money you have money so I need + + 1 + - 1 square root understand what what it what time does itself equals my number and when you say what's the square root of -1 there's no answer inside of the real line

► 01:26:14

but there is inside of this extension called the complex numbers and so it's like you're in flatland and you're trying to figure out is there anything beyond flat land so the great thing about the square root is it the question you can ask in flatland that gets you out of flat land

► 01:26:30

Jesus you confuse the shit out of me and you with this I understood that part of it yeah I understood that part of the coffee cup where my arm isn't involved right I say okay is there square root of that rotation what does that even mean dude alright well now I put my arm into the system in my arm + coffee cup gives you Spinners I'll do. I did not even know that Spinners were here

► 01:26:59

I did not know that any object required 720 degrees of rotation

► 01:27:06

so the cup Arm System we just exhibited it you don't need to learn Clifford algebra is are all of the extra Jazz that would get you the Spinners mathematically but you need to figure out how do I discover the world the Hidden World

► 01:27:20

I think about this from the perspective of like Ayahuasca somebody takes Ayahuasca and they have no idea that their brain is capable of this alternate state or LSD or 5 Meo DMT all of these things are like Panic rooms in the mind where if you lived in a house for 20 years you think you know your house and then one day you pull an old musty book off the shelf and suddenly the bookshelf swings open you know and like holy crap there's like a second home inside of my home well that's a lot of what psychedelic some like psychedelics or like square roots

► 01:27:55

in that their portals they can get you from the place that you know

► 01:28:00

into a place that you never imagined could exist do you think that the teaching of groups and a lot of these Concepts in high school would

► 01:28:11

facilitate a better understanding of it from the general public and adulthood in in the hell yeah and it would what do you think is a resistance to this is just too complex or not applicable to jobs you know is that the idea behind it is not something that you use in everyday life so that is just too weird to think about the fact that there is cousins to the electron that are fat bodybuilder cousin to go to bulk up and made out of Cork's yeah one of your think it's much worse than this I think the first of all people are terrified of just how smart children are and the difference is between children have to be buried to some children of grated abstraction a lot of the kids were great attraction at learning disabled according to the teaching system

► 01:29:04

that I personally think that most learning disabilities of a particular type are actually teaching disabilities

► 01:29:11

people don't know how to teach the smartest kids

► 01:29:14

and groups and things

► 01:29:17

you're going to lose some people because of the level of abstraction but you're going to get other people who have never been able to buy a base hit in mathematics suddenly start over performing so the problem is when you teach the stuff it's very disruptive to Notions of the hierarchy have you thought about what are the causes of these different levels of perception is it education is a genetics is it environmental is it some sort of a chemical balance of the mind like what what do you think causes people to be more perceptive than some of these Concepts what's a good question to the thing I just showed you with the planet Earth in a way that you've never seen it before I know of only two people who've ever created that image I'm one of them drawer barnet's Hunters the other maybe there are many more but I've never heard it was or meant the number of people first of all know what the Hop vibration is

► 01:30:15

I would guess is a really deeply no it is a few thousand people in the world so if none of those people are gifted at trying to visualize another care none of them program computers the number of people who could present that to the world is so small it's such a tiny Priestly class that your odds of getting anyone figuring out how to make this understandable are very small

► 01:30:42

they were talking about a very small priesthood most of them are too busy trying to do new research to want to care to communicate many of whom are not gifted communicators many of us realize that we don't fully understand these things but I can I can show you Spinners mathematically on a page but if you ask me in my darkest moments do I believe that man really knows what Spinners are I don't think so this is all the stuff that to me looks like the monolith in 2001 it just too freaky comes out of nowhere and it's at the core of reality like if you really want to blow your mind

► 01:31:16

look at a tiny number tiny collection of these objects principal fibrations Spinners exceptionally groups that he ate 248 dimensional monster decide what is that

► 01:31:30

there's a 248 dimensional set of symmetries which seems to live only to be the symmetries of itself where everything else seems to live to Summit rise something else

► 01:31:43


► 01:31:45

Jonas might have to spark that joint back up again this this this thing called that it's for the fall magic square after this guy named Shaka teeth and

► 01:31:59

these guys figured out how to generate these sets of symmetries of Dimension 5278 133 + 248 we don't know why they're there they like the platypi and the kid knows of the mathematical world they're just different they don't seem to relate to anything else that we let me know yet

► 01:32:23


► 01:32:25

that's what's so fascinating about them these are discovered by people that are trying to figure out the nature of reality they're discovered by people trying to find

► 01:32:34

more of these

► 01:32:36

bizarre question of who's who's discovering these in what's the impetus like what what is will you ask very natural questions like you probably seen you ever played Dungeons & Dragons as a kid luckily no okay

► 01:32:50

you were beating people up and stop it I've seen one video anyway you have these die by the tetrahedral die

► 01:33:02

beyond space time this is my 8D surface-piercing arch-nemesis when I was telling the story last time super sober October get Garrett Lisi me into the jungle to meet this sort of differential geometric warlord lives in the North of Maui in the jungle put that back up so well what is that well this is this is based on the 8 dimensional I'm almost certain this can be based on the 8 dimensional root system so inside of the 248 Dimensions there's an 8 dimensional donut called a Taurus like an 8 Taurus and a generate this pattern and that pattern and some sense in code the instructions for building the 248 dimensional object to somebody probably pushed in 8 dimensional thing into two dimensions for your viewing pleasure

► 01:33:58

put in this accurate like when you're looking at this this image that we're saying does that make sense to you I mean I could make bacon related things that make sense to me if the ideas I look at it the way I look at a bar Te'o Titan sent it no but this is an accurate representation if you're looking at it in two Dimensions yeah so what what what I'm trying to say is you don't even know to worry about this pattern right because you've never heard that these things exist and this is like the closest that we come to your genuine mysticism where we have these objects if there are aliens they know about 88

► 01:34:42

Bullet Barn Theatre the aliens yeah yeah I mean I will go to this later I want to interrupt your story again but I have an idea so I'm trying to get at is this is the Majesty mystery of being a mathematic mathematician and physicist these finding so if it was to say about Dungeons & Dragons dice where the normal guy is always a cube that the platonic solids you can have it an octahedron tetrahedron dodecahedron icosahedron all these things there's an analog of those five platonic solids in the next Dimension up so I think they're called convex polytope so each one of those objects has an analog one dimension up but just found out in the late 1800s there's a new platonic solid in dimension for called the 24th want to bring up the 20 for sale

► 01:35:34

find an animated video of somebody wrote a nice thing like this is something that played on you nothing about we don't really understand what it's doing there in 4 dimensions diesel Communications from

► 01:35:47

the cosmos

► 01:35:50

so this is like when Jodie Foster was in the movie contact and they were getting them signals but how to make the time machine baby are the portal machine yeah but this is stuff just doesn't come with an instruction manual part of it is you can prove that these things are there

► 01:36:07

and you don't know why they're there and some of them touch everything and some of them have yet to touch almost anything and it's like a communication from Pure design that there is so much beautiful structure and so much grace in the universe that we're just

► 01:36:25

fuck is this doing here what is it right or what is everything right what is the whole thing if you accept three-dimensional space say this class right if you accept this glass I understand that a circle can spend the glass the circle circles worth of symmetries tells me what to do to spend the last that's not that confusing why is there something with the analog of a circle where Circle I would call one dimensional beings got one degree of Freedom this thing is 248 dimensions and it doesn't seem to live to Summit rise in the jargon we would say it doesn't have a defining representation of lower Dimension the normal you have something blow Dimension and you say whether it's cemeteries in the symmetries are higher Dimension this thing seems like the first thing it wants to send matrizes itself so it's kind of self-referential kind of onanistic

► 01:37:23

so it's like a zero point of creation

► 01:37:28

that's poetic language and I would groove on that after 11 p.m. but I wouldn't call it that right now I would say it's like it I was trying to pick somebody up sexy with a describing it but it would like if we were saying the big bang you tested and that means some point in the history of the universe it was is really tiny thing and decided for whatever reason something happened and it became this enormous thing sure it possibly enormous think that it had there had to be a point where it started right but what about when I would say is we can confidently take that story back to a point and then we have to say we don't really believe that we have any insight beyond that point but people want to go there anyway we absolutely know that it was Tiny like smaller than the head of a pin the whole thing

► 01:38:24

I'm always uncomfortable since I've already settled and you can you can you can say a lot of stuff about very early very small and it cooked that could turn out to be wrong

► 01:38:36

it'll possibly long ago 14 billion years ago in our minds as far as I forgot I like you mathematics you see it on number 3 numbers on paper it all computes you see the numbers 14 billion is a number that makes sense for us but conceptually like for a dummy like me 14 billion is like if I really if I'm being honest do I really did I really have an accurate understanding with 14 billion and there's no way my number doesn't feel 14 billion either right but you know where hundred yards is a little closer to see you have some kind of an intuition pump well you know distance it's a rational distance you seen a daily basis write a hundred yards is a long distant I buy I'll gets a little weird like is that a mile away how far is 6 miles away wow I didn't think I was that far right there's a there's weirdness in distance right but when you get to 140 million miles

► 01:39:35

yeah I give up but you get to Ford Field right depth of infinitely right like this is one of the things that cross said or maybe with Sean Carroll it said it's a really not that we know that we can see 14 billion years ago it's like but that's just as far back as we're capable of seeing right now and even if we did go further the light is actually moving slower like you wouldn't be able to see it right right right so you have this thing about with the space-time metric which sort of how things are

► 01:40:18

feel like they're moving apart yeah just so you know I'm Stein said four degrees of freedom plus rulers and protractors equals SpaceTime

► 01:40:28

rights of A Spacetime metric is a collection of rulers and protractors so I can do length and angle including lengthen the time Direction

► 01:40:37

and that generates a derivative operator which we talked about before which is rise over run relative to a custom reference level the custom reference levels generate the extra staircase that we did

► 01:40:51

and that generates the curvature tensor which generates gravity so strangely with all of this kind of like woo woo stuff that we've been doing we just came to a much better description of what

► 01:41:04

theoretical physics actually looks like it's 4 degrees of freedom plus religion protractors gives you derivative operators with custom reference level 2 custom reference levels don't get together that leads to an extra staircase the degree of S&S is the curvature tensor the curvature generates the gravity which is what's keeping you and I and our chair I really appreciate that you understand you're explaining this in a way that you hope that someone can understand what no problem but you're explaining it very well. The problem is for someone like me I lack the tools to put it there. I don't have enough open slots for these Concepts so it's like it's like if you were explaining to me complex arguments in French but I didn't speak French so you're saying you know bonjour means this and then you explain all these other words and then he's throwing it all together I'm like what and then it's cultural references then you have to deal with the fact that there's like some historical precedent to certain types of behavior that are not take into consideration because he's a French people

► 01:42:04

I've lived in this way are you okay but that's nothing compared to what you're trying to do it like me send no I know me better than you know me that's true but you're also less honest than you think on this particular topic is part of each other when we hang out we hang out usually in a comedy club or somebody's house we don't like say hey we're going to take the afternoon off we're actually going to learn theoretical physics right right so when I went to stand up for the first time as I told you in Arizona I was there it was insane in there from this crazy you try to explain fucking corks to people that if you could boil it down yet 3 quarts go into a new clean out a way to do it I don't know there's a way to do it okay

► 01:43:04

mom jokes what was you saying I forgot he just he had a bunch of words that he did very very quickly and kind of hang together as like wait what yeah that sounds like a lot but when I when I had to do my 10 minutes of stand up man is that craft it's it's deep it's hard cuz you have to it's not just like telling jokes at a party it's really if the measure of the way the audience is laugh comes with your taking them along or going to divert all all sorts of things I never thought about before you know how you feel when you talk about the Hop thing that it's a part of everything it's one of the most important things and yet very few people know what it is maybe a thousand people understanding on the whole world what's odd is that number is probably identical to the number of legitimate professional stand-up comedians in the world small when I say legitimate I mean someone who can craft a new hour every two years it does Netflix specials the headlines all over the country that small good travel all over the world

► 01:44:04

you stand up it's an insanely small number of humans and I believe that my guess is that the number of people that you think are at the very top of that craft like when I really think about who really knows theoretical physics right

► 01:44:16

it's tiny bit smaller than 50 yep yep I said I would pay to see live or women that I would pay to see live it's less than 50 and less than 50 and so part of our problem is that all of the stuff that Humanity has developed is often resident in a tiny number of mines and I feel very vulnerable about the theoretical physics has been faking but it's in a healthy state for a long time we are so vulnerable on the doorstep of actually cracking this puzzle in my opinion that's where are comparisons on cuz pretty much anybody can do stand up and put enough time to it if you're silly if you figure out the crap but would you guys are doing is not just really rare but also the the barrier for entry like the cost of Entry is exceptionally high like you have to spend an inordinate amount of time studying and understanding this stuff just to get to a base

► 01:45:16

what level of what you been able to explain you been explained like some really difficult Concepts to the layperson that must have taken you fucking eons to learn and understand all your study of mathematics and geometry and of all the time an imposter how so

► 01:45:36

well I'm not a physicist right but you understand it maybe don't practice physics don't understand it well no it's it's something more than that which is that when you see you know it's at 10000 hours only sign you know only those have done that 10000 hours can come in my middle finger goes up and like I bet it's not 10000 hours work if it is 10000 hours I'm willing to get 80% of the juice in that orange with like 10% of the effort the $10,000 thing to me is it's cute but it doesn't factor in for phenoms it doesn't there's a there's a lot of people that come into anything whatever it is with some natural abilities that are pretty undeniable

► 01:46:25

you know that's a weird that's a weird equation take take something very simple like that most people don't know that that's sweet blues sound on a harmonica comes from not using it the way the manufacturer said which is called straight harp and using it instead the way African Americans figure it out which is it's much cooler to base it around the whole that nobody was expecting to draw rather than for blow and that gives you a seventh chord that sounds like sweet blues music

► 01:47:02

and how's the work

► 01:47:12

that was you gotta move by the what's the traditional way of using it what would it sound like

► 01:47:31

I think that would be Carmen boring as fuckboy table music morning as fuck white people me that damn it why people at Carmen's already but look not my point who knew when you get one of these things is the party favors a kid

► 01:47:45

there's nothing somebody says hey don't do that thing we put your mouth over I'll try you know but who knew that that's the cooler so yeah but there's something called tongue blocking there's something called cross harp there's something called the 145 progression with a scale that no music teacher ever taught you in grade school and piano all right so there's 4 secrets

► 01:48:07

and now suddenly the world opens up I mean when I open for Jordan Peterson the day proved invited me I said if you know why you play minute worth of harmonica the Masonic theater for 2500 people I became Dave Reubens talking harmonica monkey so I open for Jordan Peterson I said Uniroyal number zero life is too short not to play the harmonica everyone should learn to play the harmonica or know why they're not doing it this is great thing in the Cal Berkeley fights on will win the game or know the reason why if you don't play the harmonica it's so nice so simple so few people do it they're so small number of Secrets

► 01:48:45

you have to have a reason because I can feed myself I can I can get Housing Shelter I can meet people anywhere in the world all I have to do is carry around piece of plastic with some metal on it or you can be annoying like a lot of people I turn that fucken guy off why is he spicy playing that goddamn harmonica I want to hear that put it back in your pocket go to your next job be painted in these people's estimation attention hore out here but what's worse a harmonica or guy brings guitar and start singing folk songs at a party on the Animal House guitar you were looking to hear someone shred that's up all of these things are like options are financial apps that you can exercise them are you cannot exercise exercise but it means is an equal number of things that people would say that are like the harmonica like you should be able to do slam poetry for everyone should be able to do slam poetry if you can't do slam poetry I can feed myself I can have I can I can do slam poetry

► 01:49:45

show up at a party and everyone wants to hear slam poetry

► 01:49:48

is that true

► 01:49:51

you just try to BBW so adorable

► 01:49:56

it's fascinating to me that's that harmonicas are this little tiny thing that people if it like there's not other one's right there's like other things like these big trumpet looking things yeah because this little thing how many little things do you blow that powerful in terms of like the kind of music that makes exactly like a balls right it's always that it's so is that little candy bar looking thing because nothing is there anything comprable in terms of like musical instruments that does that little know that has that kind of sounded that's what it's optimized for but it's not weird like there's two buzz and there's other things that are similar then you get to like trombones and trumpets everything kind of makes sense then you got this little fucking thing since candy bar thing

► 01:50:47

mouth harp a mouth harp what's that other one that knows Jews old timey movies is that what it's called is a weird word for that thing all harp harp

► 01:51:04

what does maybe I'm thinking of a complete okay yeah that's one yeah like there's another weird one to play the spoons yeah well they blow into that big tube like how hard were those guys trip and when they came up with that sound like the way to Ventura and there's a dude and he's got one I'm Diggory dues out and I fucking hate you supposed to throw some money in there just out of respect this guy brought a goddamn Diggory due to the corner we are the coolest recent one it is crazy noise from this motherfucker just give me a little bit

► 01:51:51

that is DMT music I know if you're tripping balls and somebody plays that little take you to a new dimension that you've never access before the pain on for it too and everything are scented I'm a church has a lot of really interesting music to listen to it straight and kind of mind-blowing well there's also there's I don't know is that one or the something to vegetal there's one of those similar christian-based dimethyltryptamine Ayahuasca type churches that they sing songs about Jesus they trip balls and sing songs about Jesus and what's really weird about DMT in particular and I guess you could say the same of of mushrooms butt mushrooms apparently when it's synthesizes it's real similar in chemical content to Wood dimethyltryptamine is I'm going to fuck this up but I think it's an end

► 01:52:51

methyl tryptamine is dimethyltryptamine and then when it's synthesized by the body when the body processes

► 01:52:58

Scylla syban I think it produces something called for Fox 4 aloxxi N N dimethyltryptamine I think it's real close am I to fuck that up but I think it's so close that it's like their cousins okay so there's something without music in these things and one of the best ways to get out of a trip if you're you're you're really trippin balls mushrooms is a sing your way out of it you can sing your way out of a bad trip you can actually control the trip with good music and one of the things is really constant with DMT is the zika rose that the shaman will sing and these negroes with the symbols and like a little bit of drama and these like really rhythmic singing it makes the hallucination dance in like a really obvious tangible way moves around itself and it it changes and guides the trip will that's what I've my hypothesis been that it's sort of some sort of

► 01:53:59

this is what I personally experienced I've actually tripped listening to this song and it was like these geometric patterns these entities that seem to be conscious they were like moving around this is the guy this is the Ayahuasca Arrow this is Shaman blowing tobacco this is part of the ritual they actually blow Tobacco on you why you why you do that

► 01:54:26

so this guy was just this little rattle and singing and sometimes there's actual singing not just whistling but now it's like in their language that beautiful soft rhythmics or the song in the hallucinations dance to this to the sound of this music like they're supposed to dance to it like they're part of like it's not just that you're having music on top of the Psychedelic experience but that they merge emerge in the Psychedelic experience experience is 100% affected by this so it's not just that there's chemicals that are interacting with your brain you're doing something to buy responding to that music and then the music is doing something by enhancing the way your perception of this experience is and all of it is dancing together like they belong together fascinating shit yeah me my hypothesis has been that the music acts as a prosthesis to sort of lock you in because the experience is so powerful

► 01:55:24

yeah I mean maybe a little bit weird going to try to imagine somebody says you want a glass of scotch and a shaman to go with it one at a bar that's like we're going to drink this going to drink this a good intentions and I know it's going to be grabbing anybody's dick no one's going even said unless I was getting rude here there would be no wedgie right is to be nothing nothing rude will be sad you will you will think for a good solid 5 seconds before any Hasty moves like let's let's let's understand it I love you benefit from this in terms of our ability to be loose and to be silly and to get to enjoy each other's company but if a demon comes out during this time you must have dresses demon personally on your way don't pull the demon out and throw it at the party

► 01:56:16

Wright's good stuff cats but that's what happened so you know that you that the thing where they figured out that if you put a worm in the Mist call stuff that would be a great marketing device north of the Border yeah you just tell some story so now we were going to someplace that would but that is just ignorant the marketing gimmick and then and then what we do is we we found our own tequila company and we only so exclusive that you can only buy it if you also hires a shaman for the event actually was psychedelic like what if there was a way we can genetically engineer a worm to be intensely psychedelic like the worm literally is made out of Ayahuasca like we weave when we put a toad in the Moscato well don't they do weird shit like that with a little take tomatoes and they'll like you was fucking frog DNA in the Tomato to make it live longer some weird shit 30 dealing with cool stuff is like green fluorescent protein stuff you can have glow-in-the-dark rabbits and fair she makes these

► 01:57:16

yeah let's get some glow-in-the-dark bunnies but they can do that right there is something like that right so if you have Jamie do you have glow-in-the-dark rabbits brought jeans to resist pathogens in the holy fuck yeah so

► 01:57:35

how weird is that GM potato uses frog Gene to resist pathogens like that's that's real that's going on g f p rabbits

► 01:57:47

so what were you on before this we were talking about how we got the rabbits so what if we engineer that little worm rent to be like a hundred percent DMT how much is it to you see where he get down to that worm and whoever chugs to the bottom and and chews on that warms the fuck am I watching these are these glowing rabbits yet that is so weird dude it's so weird hoverboards and archery stuff we need rabbit Looney glowing rabbit here's a problem man my kids have rabbits in their cunts does rabbits little assholes they don't they don't give a fuck about each other we have two of them is so rude this would happen if they're both males and fortunately here's what happens when you get two male bunnies and you put them in a gigantic Chicken Coop they fuck each other up its bunny UFC everyday with his little ass holes all they do is kick each other's ass they chase each other around the chicken coop Cooper when they

► 01:58:47

ahold of each other they bite each other and they kick each other they fuck each other up because they're both boys and they don't want a boy to be running shit as is two bunnies fucking each other up dude this is what they do bunnies are fucking ruthless to each other these two little assholes just Chase each other all day long and beat the shit out of each other that's all they do why don't you do commentary I'm not going to I'm not going to encourage their series are Ballard, one of them was actually missing or chicken coop burnt down from the fire but the chicken survived one of them got scorched they all got fucking PTSD it's crazy I go near him but they're alive alright so we had to maneuver them and move it but one bunnies missing found one bunny one but he's missing so I think it's better for the one by that survived and the one Bonnie that probably got jacked by an eagle or some shit like that that's a rap song you had a good life you beat the shit out of your friend for a year-and-a-half solid just kicked each other's ass it's fucking horrible

► 01:59:47

ears are totally jacked shredded like I like an old bag of the death that you missed I don't think so because there's nobody I think I think a bunny got out and it probably ran away or who knows the fuck coyote got her some shit mean there's a lot of hawks lot of hawks in my neighborhood it's most likely a hawk yeah yeah but whatever just one little bunnies by himself now so they're both assholes to each other like one good bunny they just find each other like fuck you imagine just that's all you do for years that's what that's bunny life you get two male bunnies together and everyday is fuck you fuck you fuck you they run at each other and one ones always trying to get away once I was trying to eat the other one to jump on him a star by Tim and kicking out of the other one will do the same that rotate you know the last two Jews in Afghanistan both had to live in the synagogue it was all they had left that's really all they had somebody how many went went to go visit the last two.

► 02:00:47

and sit like why aren't you guys friends as one of them says here I'll show you a small

► 02:00:55

want to have lunch the other guys drop dead so you see what I'm working with is like the most Jewish conversation between the last two do they can't get along so they like the two rabbits that all the others went away what they're probably really horny and lonely and confused I suppose yeah me what the fuck is only two of them they need to get to Israel. Org why you wanted it died and then the last one is is just be the last guy someone talk to him I know if it's possible for you to get to Jerusalem. You people they'll just you have a party over there everything will be great Jewish food everyone's speaking Hebrew everyone's United will like the last three Jews of Kerala was a young woman and two guys just but now neither one of you forget this thing I know it's rough Man Zero Jews

► 02:01:44

like zero yeah yeah nope the whole country like whoa whoa whoa out here sir 0-0 melting it was one ingredient hope hot sauce to sit in the Taliban actually really needed the Jewish Community cuz they wanted to be able to say we could create relations with Afghanistan's Jewish guys to do that hate each other exactly very polarizing true I don't know how we got to go glowing bunnies I'm not getting any fucking bunnies man or assholes trying to get to guy and a girl together you going to fix the girl otherwise you can have a million bunnies and they're all going to be kicking each other's asses solideal the Buddy apocalypse what would really fucked-up is reading about animals that that fight like right out of the womb have they they kill their part of the kill the good sibling yeah pull up a bucket siblicide in

► 02:02:41

blue and Nazca boobies

► 02:02:45

what are the Nazca booby do they live in the Nazca Lines or these bullies boobies

► 02:02:51

Jimmy help me out here hanging on the word booby how do you spell that in AZ CA and then boobies that usually I'm trying to remember what I was reading about where obligate siblicide when one animal comes out the other one tries to kill the other one almost immediately hello hyenas hyenas hyenas there's been there's been evidence of hyenas attacking their sibling while it's in the amniotic sac and there's when they come out the bigger one or the stronger one of the boys whatever one's healthy will almost immediately start attacking its sibling and try to kill it

► 02:03:33

pull up that if that's true pretty sure that's true I want to see boobies went into this one of those crazy rabbit hole about hyenas recently what a bizarre animal that is so that the false penis penis is just one aspect of everything everything about 1% of the women die okay here goes I will get some similar size when a sibling almost always ends up being killed fugitive siblicide means the suicide facultative I got the choice versus you got to do in Denver mental conditions okay so it's sometimes will happen if there's none of resources it what dates of the idea that I think the breeding cycle is discretized see you either make it or you don't and so the danger of laying one egg and having it not work out is very nice fucking this is brother up and it has to be in front of mom and dad cuz you want to prove that you're worthy well that isn't saying price of my

► 02:04:33

look at his beating it to death so this is because there's not enough food there's not enough food to do too so the first one that the second one is a spare in the first one Cruise Cruise. He's worthy by killing a sibling the spare in front of the parents and says yeah you can invest in me I got this thing Jesus Christ and what kind of bird is this is probably NASCAR blue-footed boobies is my guess that isn't saying that I'm saying it's hard to watch what is what I said about biology biology cares about your feelings and the mom doesn't give a fuck about it other than the mom the mom wants it look the moms excited this one's dying fucked up in the moms like an older one knows what it's doing he's Bible Jesus Christ was pretty brutal now it's it's bizarre seeing this from God I don't want to see this thing slowly die dude it's bizarre sing it from Birds but I think it's even more ruthless the way that I am yeah hyenas hyenas killing their siblings that almost I think they were say

► 02:05:33

it's pretty Universal that has been the first one comes out to try to kill the second one you know this thing about lying female lions getting excited by the murder of their children wow so the new when the new mail Takes Over The Pride his first order of business maybe let's not stop wasting resources on the previous Daddy's Offspring so what happened and gets out and immediately starts killing its sibling they're fighting to the death right out of the womb look at this fucking mad battle as babies but it's got stuck at the sack on it and it just trying to kill each other

► 02:06:13

this is a particularly ruthless animal they were they were saying that 60% of hyenas die as a trying to get out of the tube wow

► 02:06:24

what I didn't know that 20% of women die or the females rather die when they're giving birth that's because of our brain to body ratio female hyenas start a giant dick sorry I thought you were talking about high rates of human female hyenas 20% of the time when they giving birth is the baby doesn't come out right like they have this crazy you know they have a faux penis that is actually a vagina to its in a Norms huge engorged clitoris is far bigger than the males have to pull it back so the mail can populate with them but then when they give birth to come out of that dick and they don't it doesn't always come out right so I just might be wrong about the numbers but it's some exorbitant number of babies die and a huge number of women. Women and women female hyenas dying but way bigger than the males and that's because the males won't let the babies eat so that

► 02:07:24

one of the things I think like if something is are scavengers the males are trying to push out everything smaller so because of that the females have to get and go fuck off to get us to eat like even if it's their kids at school suffocate on their way out 60% of them died on the way out yeah and I think it's 20% of the females die during childbirth as well pretty sure that's what I read which is fucking bananas I mean 60% though imagine 60% of all kids die on the way out and then the ones that don't die if you got two of them one of them kills the other one

► 02:07:58

the rough neighborhood matriarchal society yeah that's what I'm saying what is the purpose of the fake penis to dominate the men they get on top of the band they go listen bitch so it's going to be I got a big ol strap-on they pack their men at all male Hyena's are cucks they all take it's crazy it's crazy it's where we're heading is the country in diameter really Jesus ouch that creates a high death rate for first-time mothers yeah I think it's 20% the full human clitoris yes I've seen one have you

► 02:08:41

I not in the wild the full the full cleared now I know I'm a man never seen it like a biological can you pull up the the internal clitoris internal clitoris I think it was only discovered is it not allowed to be quickly think about that yeah I guess in trouble will you can pull it up and just don't show the world to show us. Yeah if you think if you put that on YouTube will be demonetize and possibly kicked off the network to do about yourself yeah it's Google it you weirdo and and be careful of the Wrath of the government Norma's structure that I think we didn't fully understand I don't understand how we could have missed it but my understanding was we didn't fully understand the internal clitoris there on the left below it looks exactly like this sort of space ships from War of the Worlds 1953 it's all that stuff on the outside the all you see on the outside temperature cop in trouble

► 02:09:36

to get mad at us does that picture make you horny no not really afraid that it seems like the Facehugger yeah it's very weird that we've just come to accept what the shape of the body is very bizarre I mean if we were all shaped like stingrays we saw a person would be like what in the holy fuck is that thing yeah but it's articulating fingers and move into eyeballs around sniffing things which nostrils like we just accept the fact that this shape is is normal but it makes sense with this is why cephalopods wood from last time when we were talking to paddlefish yeah Mike I just learned something new which is the cephalopods are under consideration to be the next great model organism for biology so if you think about how weird it is it's some branch of the phylogenetic trees so far distance from us that these mollusks

► 02:10:36

such Advance mines and you know their skin is the wonder of the world for sure yeah nobody knows quite how all of that not only do they have these chromatophores to get the camouflage right but they also change the texture of their skin to mimic things like coral and all the stuff off

► 02:10:54

would it be cool if we made cephalopods the next great model organism and then we started doing comparative like Natalie neuroanatomy but connectomics where we're trying to study how their brains organized because they're so far away they are probably the closest we will ever get to meeting aliens I think I said that the last and I'm really excited if that's goes forward but it really doesn't seem like anything else alright you know whether it's a cuttlefish whether it's an octopus like it you like oh it's like kind of like a squid like yeah a little bit like a person's like a monkey yeah but what real difference of Nautilus is the craziest thing you know maybe if not in the Cuttlefish the most interesting for sure they're both fast

► 02:11:42

yeah but it would be fun to do

► 02:11:45

Matt would imagine that newts and salamanders and in the tetrapod category would be the best for us to study for regeneration I like how they regenerate up to a point like nature say yeah that's a wrap yeah you know you lose your head and they just like I gave up a big piece he gave up the queen Tovar yeah games over to grow your tail back we can lizards grow their tail back do you know but they only grow like most of it they don't go the whole thing but the newts and salamanders seem to have this very high Ridge and I mean you just had an arm off over and over again there is the can't cut their head off and just saying it's weird like you can't like chopped in half from the waist down they don't see you up and going to waste like that's it you can only get rid of the limbs yeah but you can get rid of the limbs like nature is evolved a strategy for dealing with probation just give him the arm

► 02:12:45

what do you think about the fact we had this successful head transplant in monkeys in like the early 70s and then we walked away from it probably could move otherwise change the Beverly Hills I'd be getting new bodies getting her head screwed on to new release yeah yeah people would figure out a way to transplant two brains and wants to live forever 800 year old brain and talk about motorcycle victim going to start dealing well then I guess it's I thought it was kind of a weird mood and then say okay too much can an hour do you think that's what they did or it was probably hard to get funding people thought you're playing God the guy who did it I think was it was good because you know there's a lot of this reference for human form and if a religious person is doing it we feel better than somebody is a desecrating write write some atheist

► 02:13:45

that scientists that doesn't send on a monkey that might save babies but it's another thing if you just say what happens if I cut this monkey's head off stick it on another monkey cuz all this crazy I know if you've ever seen this the Russians had this film introduced by JBS haldane great English biologist was also a communist in there for Barry price of it and there's this experiment was experiments in continuation of the brain after death and they hook up the head to an artificial circulatory system and they started continue to have interactions where they swab the head and they get the eyelash movement in that the tongue comes out to lick and eat things it's quite interesting I would recommend it as one of the greatest quotes

► 02:14:45

Donna Williams the universe quicker than you suppose it's quicker than we can suppose what a great quote he was also the inordinate fondness of beetles guy inordinate fondness of noodles the Archbishop of Canterbury found himself and exceeded across from haldane and wanted to needle him because he was a communist atheist and he said you know tell me what what what does your study of the biological would inform us about how great Creator and how then shot it back is it that he has an inordinate fondness for beetles because Beatles are so highly speciated and what was his reaction

► 02:15:22

what I think was a different era that it's not that hard of a burn while we're really committed to the idea that all the stuff that we can do manipulating the planet rent put sending rockets in the space that that's more important than when an ant does what we're really committed to this that are significance although it's clearly if we working together we believe in a sense of Pride and it's more important each other to us it is but to the whole thing isn't really more important Suzuki mean if people didn't exist we were wiped off the planet all the other animals would be okay I'm really would be okay me we would gain and lose and more predators and we wouldn't be controlling the population sure but if all the ants went away that would be a rap we're done. No more people this is one widely decided that if we lost all insect which Presley all ants like he probably would collapse all the eagles

► 02:16:22

things that we need to sustain human life I have a feeling of those water bear tardigrade be like well we wouldn't be able to make it but it would make it a lot of other stuff you know the thing that I think would make it anyway maybe they're wrong

► 02:16:46

if all ants died human beings go extinct just Google that I think I think I read a paper proposing that and they were explaining the critical role that plants play in all these different ecosystems and how the biomass of ants worldwide is equal to or greater than the biomass of human beings okay

► 02:17:09

terminate tuition around then yeah sounds reasonable. I'm pretty sure that's true and so but our ideas and we're more important well we have cable gear for G okay baby that high of a 70 inch television I have an iWatch must be more important stupid fucking aunt was dirthouse

► 02:17:35

if I can just piss on your house while I go jogging more important thing in you yeah I don't by pissing on you obviously Nature's want to protect you look at your house in the dirt it's a whole lot on Mound and I want to get serious on your nerves just trying to fuck with me but the really interesting thing about humans is that where the only species that understands what game were in and we can reject the game every other species is playing the game so you know you know my brother very well very surprising to me that my brother only wanted to have two kids and didn't want to like spend all the time down at the Sperm Bank you know making donations I said you're in evolutionary theorist you ever think it's kind of weird that you're not playing this game very effectively and be back this thing you said

► 02:18:27

if you actually understand the game why would you want to continue to play it

► 02:18:32

I thought that was like really interesting that somebody who sounds like his wife doesn't want anymore kids I get it bro I found says all insects dying I just answered 50 years for people to disappear for that according to find out the biomass of ants that's even trippier

► 02:19:01

open my I want to get rid of this anti-human thing cuz I'm not answering you know I know I know you're neutral neutral because we're more significant to each other but there's no significance in the whole game if you just take it completely materials like what do parrots one Rahman spec big deal alright so the problem is if you accept that as an answer then you kind of failed by just taking the the nihilist way out and talk to me like you know that they have his annual question at the edge. Org and you finally got exhausted just want to ask another one so I'll finish this up quick memo I'm sorry and averaging 1 to 5 mg cord to species when combined all ants in the world taken together way about as much as all human beings

► 02:19:56

that's how yeah that's what I'm saying that's fucking bananas

► 02:20:02

who they are 15 to 20% of the terrestrial animal biomass and in tropical regions where answer especially abundant they monopolize 25% or more

► 02:20:18

I meant after I have a buddy of mine Bryan Callen accounting used to he when he was in college he spent some time in the jungle he was thinking it was going to be a biologist it was going to study insect is going to be in what is an insectivore in Switzerland they had to sleep in these elevated tents and they had to paint like some sort of like turpentine type chemical all over the posts because of they didn't the ants would crawl up the post and eat you in your sleep what I literally climb in your ear and start eating you and tell everybody and you would die that way people died elephants have been eaten by ants and he said you can hear them walking in the jungle like in the night you hear you hear the footsteps of fucking Aunt cuz there's so many of them if you're in the wrong place at the wrong time and there's a path of these motherfuckers moving your way and they send a signal that we got something

► 02:21:18

and they crawl up you they just all start crawling up you and there's so many of them you can avoid it will because they're not really separate animals are there use social hymenoptera has this weird property of this tablet diploid structures of the females are highly related to each other and so in the same way that your cells aren't individual animals that are all conspired to create you there is a sense in which in this world of bees and ants and wasps and things I might hymenoptera the real entity is the colony it's not the individual right so you know if I took a psychological approach them

► 02:21:57

to you I just went set sail by cellular your ear this collection of Unit 10 or 50 trillion separate entities and that's what makes ants so terrifying is it the Unicorn Park in the great Anarchist sort of an amateur naturalist and he would look to Natural systems and say why can't humans cooperate like this point is we're not structured to cooperate in this eusocial fashion the way they cooperate is so uncanny when those leafcutter ants design those intricate cities with they have places were things from meant and we're good we're gases are released through holes in the ground and it doesn't make any sense that this little tiny brain could figure out this enormous structure but somehow or another when combined and not right not just one one version of this but millions and millions of these designs appear all over the world and they

► 02:22:57

if you can find a video of they filled a leafcutter ant colony they filled the the home with molten metal you have something like that why they call it but it it was concrete they flooded Concrete in all the holes and then they dug out everything around it so you could see the structure and then they explained what there's this is really like well thought-out like damn portals and if this is how to get the food in and this is where they take the leaves and they they let they let them rotten to turn to mulch and there's like a gas release distributed Loosely coupled system what makes it seem so amazing it is utterly amazing but if you think about it as individuals making decisions that conspired to create these and these structures it's less than its

► 02:23:47

that's more amazing than what it is which is it's a Loosely coupled distributed system you know so that's how a beehive will send out explorers and the report back and I'll do the dance the dance communicate the information and you got all these coordinated activities in what other systems do you suppress fertility of females because the relatedness is so high on in this is gorgeous yeah this is the video were talking about and so this is It's really huge too and they have these looks like tunnel systems and then they lead to these big circular areas where there really almost uniform in size and it's really strange way or similar in size they so they have these Pathways that go to these like rooms the circular rooms and there's just

► 02:24:43

miss incredible network of these tubes in circular rooms that they uncover and it's fucking enormous when you look at how big this thing if you had to say was that 80 feet across 90 feet across or something like that could guess so they're continuing to dig this up and I've been done in this video here but you see all the pipes that extend to the left and to the right so they develop some sort of complex civilization some weird bizarre network of these passageways and and rooms and they do it just like this everywhere so some pattern has emerged in their species that has set them up to act as this Collective group and then operating a similar fashion all over the world where wherever they exist in that sort of that kind of dirt they can manipulate right that that's

► 02:25:40

that alone is what it that is a massive mystery and how a little tiny thing with a brain that's almost imperceptibly small this is like tiny little head little head you figure out that whole how do you figure not talk or not but right okay so if you look at samples of C elegans the housing sales for the entire body plan 300 of which are neurons we have a complete map not only the cell lineage diagram which is how this thing unfolds from a single fertilized egg but we also have a complete wiring diagram of its nervous system so this is something that locomotive to moves around and eats has sex

► 02:26:25

and it's only got 300 Durant each of those is extremely primitive machine and they send signals to each other and we still don't know that how The Thing Really Works even though we've got the entire thing that Jesus was the great inside of Sydney Brenner that we would make the the worm the great model organism because

► 02:26:49

we could actually map everything about it right and it is astounding to me how little we've learned we've learned a ton from it but I had thought that we would have gotten much farther in understanding the brain

► 02:27:03

did you see this recent discovery of a 25 foot long sea worm that apparently is not just one organism is like many organisms together combined yeah I got to find out about that yeah you got to see this fucking thing it's insane and I think it's a very recent discovery at least one this large and these guys are swimming around with this thing it looks impossible it looks like Dave Dale and it on another planet and they are experiencing this thing

► 02:27:39

like this thing this whatever this is I'm pretty sure with that what I read I read it really quickly as I was running out the door that it exists large 88m worm-like sea creature stuns New Zealand diver so they're looking at this thing but I think there's many different organisms inside of it I don't think it's one individual organism

► 02:28:01

yeah it's made up of hundreds of thousands of organisms I've never seen ya like what what is it like what does that mean is this is a weird tube for folks that are watching this or listening to this rather we're looking at is the divers that are just tripping balls here they like what in the fuck is this and it looks like like an enormous tube like jellyfish type creature that's in the water it almost looks semi translucent right we just say it's enormous it's so big it's like the size and what moves and changes but it sometimes it's a larger than a human waste or human chest and other times it gets real skinny but it's

► 02:28:48

fucking huge like look at that what is that that I'm stunned the fact that they're saying that it's made up of hundreds of thousands organism like how is it made up of different stuff like what is it I'll give you ever heard of anything like this I like the Portuguese man-of-war I think is like 5 different organisms collaborate and effect really the Portuguese man-of-war is not like a one thing

► 02:29:16

what are the size of thing above the water

► 02:29:20

that is fucking crazy

► 02:29:23


► 02:29:25

just whatever the ocean is like that they were all trying to look into space like I wonder if there's aliens out there there were here I know

► 02:29:35

like one of those cuttlefish or octopus or this God damn thing low high row Somme what the fuck that thing looks like a geometric pattern

► 02:29:46

that's a nice Moon one look at one of the upper right hand corner Jamie what is that weird looking fucking what is that thing 60 ft long jet-powered animal oh God it's like a civilization sick I ship of these things flying through the ocean we were seeing this before what the fuck is that that is so weird looking a come on man that looks like something from Avatar doesn't it totally does right like they could something that comes up that tree James Cameron look at this thing so this is what those things are but the other one is a very smooth or it's low resolution and we can get a really good look at it but that's what it is it's just a collective group of hundreds of thousands of organisms that combined together and they're getting jacked by that turtle

► 02:30:36

all you bitches

► 02:30:40

what a weird weird organism

► 02:30:46

check your arm in it it's just dude how bizarre is it that is a civilization of these things all combined with what they are as individuals that operate as a giant tube

► 02:31:01

and you never heard of this before now I'm so happy we found something you don't know about that was really an alien world yeah these guys with the remote submersibles and they find some new life for ya take me down leave me those wait what is that because I get really excited because it's it's the ability to meet there are new things new kind of sort of mapped out the biology teacher more or less age ever see those or the sulawesi boars or the other dear really vampire deer I don't know I don't know about vampire the craziest looking thing ever it's deer with fangs like crocodile looking fat

► 02:32:00

they come hanging down like this this is some Jackalope thing no it's not it's a weird little animal it's on a big deer either will do you not like that thing

► 02:32:11

vampire deer

► 02:32:13

that's a real animal do that

► 02:32:16

how fucking strange

► 02:32:22

who do the fucking teen on that thing

► 02:32:25

it's probably something akin to their antlers they use it to defend themselves okay that's not real that was not real cuz that's a mule deer so that one that you just picked that's that's in Photoshop bullshit what's interesting is apparently elk have these things called that people called ivories now but they would they are is at one point in time they have tusks like a bore a giant hosta probably added them and their fights and they eventually shrink and now they're just as weird Serta nuby thing actually have some here I'll show it to you yeah I bet they're in the after the podcast will show them to you but it date there this weird thing that's like not quite a tooth it's Ivory that grows inside their had and it one point time it was some kind of a weapon just like their head it's me the antlers are you know what's the largest what how do we describe this what was the the quickest growing

► 02:33:22

staying in the animal world is the the antlers of an elk look how fucking huge they are they fall off every year and they grow back every year and it's all just for fighting and they used to grow back tusks to all these to have the answer to test for permanent but these just did just for duking it out yeah crazy Weaponry sexual selection what you want a really weird thing as a dung beetle that there's a conserve system whereby and some dung beetles the amount of Weaponry you have is your antler is inversely proportional to the amount of copulatory apparatus you have where it counts and so if you have really impressive Weaponry you're not able to do quite as much and that maybe the engine is speciation because the vagina and penis that system is a lock and key and so something shrinks too much then you can't necessarily get get the job so far

► 02:34:22

3D dung beetle with giant horns fucks everybody up his jeans can't pass on that maybe there's a certain amount of cooperation is needed in the dung beetle world yeah can't have an oppressor can of Genghis Khan of the dung beetle world the patriarchy in the NBA the world look at the size of the antlers on that guy yeah girls make fun of them probably the dung beetle World Lamborghini exactly like what you doing over there with his giant it looks like elk antlers probably hung like a roach alright have a question for you I started looking into this like primitive hunting positively predisposed towards hunting and I turn myself off of I don't hunt but I turn myself off of hunting

► 02:35:15

by watching the affect of some of these people who are baiting and killing bears in ways that it just doesn't feel to me like hyper respectful and I wondered if there's like a deeper layer where if I got even deeper into it I would understand it or am I actually correct that there is something weird about the effect of attracting some beautiful bear to a kind of easy place to kill it and then just getting super excited about

► 02:35:47

doing it in well your Natural Instincts there's a reason for them and you're most certainly correct it's it's a weird feeling that the idea that you're going to trick this bear and didn't think he's going there to eat and then you kill him bear hunting is different than any other kind of hunting in the first of all there's a lot of emotional attachment to it because people of teddy bears things on those lines but bears are decided they're beautiful they definitely are they definitely are also one of the more ruthless animals in the animal kingdom and they're all cannibals all of them and the males don't don't just go after the Cubs they eat them and they did go after them specifically to eat them and then when the males get chased off the female what year on Cubs and this is universal they're also responsible for the death of it least 50% of undulate tabs and fawns whether it's moose cows so I don't have any of these issues so they also are really difficult to hunt and their populations

► 02:36:47

what by wildlife biologist are important to keep under control so like by all so in areas of extreme density for us you will not kill them unless you bait you will not so if you want to things have to happen either fuse dogs which is what they used to use a lot and he sees me California to the 1990s they outlawed Hound hunting and then they dating around the same time with the essentially did in Northern Cal in California is they outlawed bear hunting but they didn't you can still hunt bears but it's extremely difficult almost impossible with a bow or very very unlikely like your rate of success of extreme though if you want to control populations if you like to eat moose and deer or you want to have them keep healthy population for any don't want the bear and crouching on these rural homes and these are you have to control their populations and there's very few other ways to control their populations other than baiting them to assume that I was positively predisposed to hunting I do think that they're beautiful creatures

► 02:37:47

I think their emotional creatures but I understand they're all they're all beautiful the weird form of trickery and we don't think it's sporting right but the idea is that if you really want to control their populations you have to accept that this is a necessary evil so that so that I can grasp still at the level the thing that surprised me was that the effect wasn't the expected effect of the Hunter

► 02:38:23

with reverence in some sense sufficient reverence for the kill yeah that's what flipped me out well there's people get excited and they get happy that they're successful because it is difficult to learn if you take that out of context and take that out of context and people get happy especially when they get happy they're getting happy around people that have no problem with hunting scene one of the problems with respect is that assume that you only have that respect if you don't have happiness that goes along with that really understand that that there is Summit Mount of sadness some amount happiness is a weird like I lost it so there's a lot of weird stuff that goes on a prize in the reason I'm asking you is that I had expected that I would have the difficulty Bears equal teddy bears I get past that I keep on going around this whole thing then when I finally got to the end it was just the there wasn't the right balance

► 02:39:19


► 02:39:20

sadness ecstatic elation

► 02:39:24

it's hard it's hard it's hard if you're not there experiencing it it's it's hard if you're not involved in this hunt for many many days and it gets very difficult when you put on you don't know if it's ever going to happen but the bear hunting in particular especially over bait is way more problematic psychologically don't know I think there's a really good argument and I support this argument that you must keep bear population in control if you want people and in all those of the animals to live in harmony. It's because if you don't there's nothing else to keep their populations in control have died by the other than bigger Bears grizzly bears and grizzly bears and they get out of hand our way scarier that's a real it's a real giants real giant problem in terms of our

► 02:40:08

or anthropomorphisation of these animals you know attaching these human attributes in the human thoughts and and thinking of them as our friends in the forest and then what they actually are the people that live out there. My guess is that if I went hunting with you

► 02:40:25

I would expect to see you elated after 3 days of frustration yes on a on a good hunt I expect that you would use the kill responsibly that you would forgo certain kinds of kills I don't have any of those issues I think I think that where the issue is is that I wouldn't expect an unbalanced relationship yeah I understand what you're saying and especially an unbalanced Elation when you're hunting over bait for an animal that is not necessarily thought of in our culture as being an animal you eat which is better A lot of times people think that you don't eat them black bears in particular actually they taste very good and people do eat them when you deal with people I got a friends my friend John and Jenn rivet who live in Alberta and there they are hunting guides it's a real necessity up there to hunt bears because there is nothing else is keeping their populations in check and if you ever go up there you see an extraordinary amount of

► 02:41:25

well you could see 1920 bears in a day well they're everywhere and there's a high density of them and they just decimate the deer population they decimate the moose population and there's some of them that learn that they get in the garbage cans they are breaking in people's cars and Destroy them if killed a few people but it's pretty rare most of time they realize that people are dangerous they stay the fuck away but it's not what would I appreciate is spot and stalking traditional prey animals that's what I like to do I like to spawn stock deer and Elk because I feel like

► 02:42:02

first of all there the most delicious they make wither make sense or not to make the most sense to me in terms of like a prey animal did the ones that I covet the most what I want to do is I want to go and get older mature animals that are Anjali it's an animal that spread its genetics that is already it's you know 7 8 years old 9 years old is animal that doesn't have much time left if you get it now you're probably getting it within a year of its death whether it's by natural causes wolves cold starvation you are you're doing it probably the most Humane you're giving it probably the most Humane death it's reasonably possible for this thing is unless it falls off a cliff and even then it's the

► 02:42:50

it might survive that for a little while you when you're shooting an animal with an arrow it's dead and seconds you know you hit in the heart and they shot an elk this year it literally walked for yards in tipped over it just step step step boo I'm very impressed with the skill of some of these I guess this is the printed primitive hunting

► 02:43:15

I think you should I think you should be really careful

► 02:43:21

about anything that you do that's not that accurate that's that's an issue it's a giant issue elbows are extremely accurate right and there's guys that can shoot a paper plate at a hundred twenty yards every single time they could shoot a little plate like that they'll Dell bet their life they can drop an arrow into that 120 yards every single time you can get good at that you can get rid of you have good technique and reasonable control of your emotions and your anxiety in the Heart In the Heat of the Moment you don't ever shoot anything in 220 yards though you shooting at things 30 yards 40 yard in the degree of success is very high with skilled Hunters view their ethical and Ash on their shot decisions is that primitive stuff is like why why you throwing Spears like what it what are you doing you trying to prove that you're better than people use a bow and arrow like this is not an accurate or effective thing I mean it kind of is but you have to be like 5 yards 10

► 02:44:21

cards like we going to be 15 yards max even though I think part of the thrill of it for them is putting themselves in danger there's a little bit of that

► 02:44:29

if you shoot an arrow you going after a bear yeah like I've seen some of these things filmed where the person looks like you know they're up in there I don't know what to call it there a little tree stand treestand and that doesn't look like they're putting a lot of risk but some of these people are clearly getting off on this is the Primal hunt right and this is they're going backwards into something where that the animal could surprise them and what I what I wanted to do was I wanted to reacquaint myself with you know now that I can I can watch somebody actually in that moment try to figure out what my ethics around hunting were and I thought that I prepared myself and I just I thought went when I was when I saw you find out where Joe is because I have no question knowing your ethics and how you think that you would have a very subtle perspective on all these different kinds of kills which sorts of animals

► 02:45:29

yep you get to Spears you're in a weird place like like you said I only spear wild pigs were trying to get rid of him anyway okay that's where in a weird place where we replaced because ethically I think you have two choices three choices you 3 choices are rifle which is number one attic Lee realistically because if you shoot something with a rifle you you can be really accurate like out to a hundred yards a hundred percent of the time like unless it's crazy windy out or the some weird conditions altitude affect ballistics but not that much out 200 yards your fucking deadly if you have a really good control of squid squeezing the trigger are you not jerk and everything and not panicking

► 02:46:18

Dem Boyz II yunobo it requires way more practice way way more fine-tuning of your motor skills but it still possible then you have crossbow which is even more effective than a bow faster more feet per second faster feet per second so that it it travels at a flat line cuz it's going quicker before it drops they'll drop the same speed right bullets and arrows all drop at the same speed they just don't get there at the same speed so the same amount of time like if I'm shooting something at a hundred yards in it with a bow I am aiming with with a site that is calculating for the fact that the arrow is going to drop significantly and the time that it takes if it's going to hundred and eighty feet per second is like a normal speed for a good ball with a good heavy Arrow that's 280 ft per second that goes a hundred yards okay A Bullet is going to go a hundred yards far quicker

► 02:47:15

but in the same amount of time it takes that Arrow to get to that Target the bull is going to drop the same amount of the arrow that's what most people don't understand so a crossbow is more ethical because it's more accurate it's just have fewer moving Parts you can actually sit on a rest and just squeeze the trigger easier to manipulate and the the arrow is traveling faster so it's called bolt traveling faster shuttle drop less

► 02:47:41

after that chick get squirrely okay alright well you can kill things with it and people have done it but it gets to how accurate are you and it what is Witcher ethical drain right I can have to go range for a really good Hunter with a bow and arrow is probably 80 yards me and maybe it's a moose 90-yard something big butt with a spear like what do you got you got 10 yards so you know why that's the question are you doing it for me are you doing it because is this your Mount Everest you want to kill a pig with a spear and are you saying that as pig is not worth as much so you should be able to kill this beer cuz these are all weird you're weird decisions decisions and people make those with bears they make those decisions of black bears like people that live where they they consider them nuisances they they they killed them I mean they used to be used to allow them to shoot you

► 02:48:41

Lauda hunt used to be allowed to hunt black bears with a spear in Alberta until a big Scandal a couple years ago

► 02:48:49

where a guy filmed himself doing that he shot a berry killed a bear with spear and was Hoot and Holler and and and people put got a hold of video and that is disgusting and protested it and then of the people from Under Armour dropped his wife from there you know they had the sort of sponsorship deal with them and it is not eating cause a rift in The Hunting Community some people think you should be the head with a rock and other people like okay but what are we doing are we just going out to get meat or are we putting on a macho performance of our ability to this is exactly what I wanted to get averages if you know the population has to be controlled and you want the meat then it makes sense to me that you have to open yourself up to some of the pleasure of the kill that makes some sense but what I saw just like flipped me out because

► 02:49:49

and Beyond and other things impressed by the sum of the skill on population control you doing it for the maze wasn't surprised by it that's not surprising it's not surprising you know I mean I think if you

► 02:50:12

if you were there you'd probably be even more conflicted cuz you actually was there in the presence of the thing dying No watching A Bear die on the video is one thing but being there alive when they die completely different thing

► 02:50:28


► 02:50:29

it's it's a very complicated thing because we have these deep set

► 02:50:36

emotional connections to certain animals that my friend Steve rinella is going to be actually on tomorrow he calls the charismatic megafauna the way of this different view of certain animals bears in particular

► 02:50:50

but if you use the animal respectfully respectfully and you kill it ethically and you do I don't have any problem with honey bears and in fact I think it's actually and the sadness it really isn't necessary to ask it is something that even if you don't like to hunt bears if you're living in a place like Alberta you probably should hunt bears because you should do your part there's a lot of them out there and in one of the things that becomes an interesting relationship is a relationship between the Moose hunters and the deer hunters and the bear hunters that they have kind of those Smart Ones have come to an understanding that even if I don't hunt bear I need those people out there doing it but it's how do you do it and why you doing it I think you I've seen animals died very quickly with a bow and arrow they died very quickly but never seen animal David spear I don't think it's necessary but I don't want to be the person that tells you you can't do it if you have an ethical range of 5 yards and you only hunt bear with a spear at 5 yards

► 02:51:50

and you kill it immediately you hit it and kill it you're right then you're right there that's not based on the method it's based on what what are the ethical parameters around the can I appreciate it also I would kind of be a hypocrite because even though I can ethically kill something at 40 yards or feet just figure out what the number is depending on the size of the animal in even though I can do that I could do it way easier with a rifle that's why am I using a bow and arrow why do I want to make it more difficult why am I making it more challenging why am I requiring myself to practice but because it's a very important question to ask because I was just doing it just for the meet I would probably use a rifle right now I think that part of it has to do with the Primal association with the kill and then the key question is how do you want to indulge that what is the set and setting blah blah blah so that was the that was the thing I found shocking this is what I thought you know I understand something about the need to control population it's the effect

► 02:52:50

really killed me well again we're talking about bears you know this such as Bears other animals as well yeah I mean I saw

► 02:53:02

I don't want to focus more on necessarily but just a question I had to ask you because I sort of I was very surprised by my own reaction well a lot of people are taking issue my good friend Ben O'Brien who's a brilliant writer whose actually also a hunter is advocating that people stop taking what he calls grip and grins what a grip and Grant is like say if you shot a beautiful dear you're holding the deer up by the antlers and you're smiling and he's advocating that those photos of problematic because people who don't hunt look at it like you're some bloodthirsty asshole that super happy that something died and that's not even though that's not how the people feel when they taking those photos but there are as happy that something which is very difficult would you know special using a bow most people go home empty-handed it's right you requires too much Fitness Physical Fitness cuz you're going up and down right now and it requires too much accuracy and training and technique and archery most people fuck it up and then there's dealing with anxiety

► 02:54:02

most people suck it up but after it's all over this is great feeling of elation right you did it I can't believe it came together while cuz it was probably not going to come together and people happy these are people again that already accept hunting now do you take someone who is an animal rights activist or someone who deeply appreciate the animals and then you show him that photo they have a completely different association with what that photo means what that photo means is he's an asshole who's up Trophy Hunter Reid I don't know any species

► 02:54:35

that celebrates a kill for food with Glee chaps do well then they do it socially then they they share it you know through altruism ice cream in each other yeah so that's my favorite species almost there yeah the terrifying little fuckers so where do you think we are on the political from haven't even touched that I think it's right the same way as bowhunting versus Spears and rifles it's all this this world's Messi you know all these things are messy do you see a way in which the political epic comes to an end

► 02:55:20

the only hope that I have is through reasonable dialogue becoming an accepted and appreciated thing a celebrated thing and if this is possible that people could realize there's some stupidity to this team mentality that we have is Right versus left which is almost all a good percentage of it is he's assume identities write these these predetermined patterns that get adopted in order to as we first started talking about this and in order to establish yourself as someone who's in a group you get accepted by this group and you see it left and right I mean I don't want to name any names but there's a bunch of people to do it blatantly you see them and I've even seen him switch teams and he see them switch teams and I don't buy the rationalizations when it comes to ideology but I think is what they're doing is there switching teams because they realize there's an inn on this team and they can just say this is the problem with the team I used to be on those fucking losers and

► 02:56:20

it really Benedict Arnold's right and it looks like they probably have as much of an Infinity to the ideas of one side of the do the other side they just go all in on one side to get acceptance from the group you just don't white people change their opinion that much over two years since like that you know it's like they just decide this group makes more sense now and I've been attacked by people on the left so I'm going to go to the right or vice versa and usually what it is is me and you wouldn't even when they say they've been attacked like oh you fucking baby there's 300 million people just in this country alone if you put something out there publicly and 1000 people attack you don't act like you're being persecuted okay you have an idea you've you've launch that idea out into the Zeitgeist and people took a big shit on it you know whether it's people on the right of people on the left you got to be able to argue your point one way or the other and not just immediately jump ship when someone who shares ideas with you decide that your idea sucks and maybe they're wrong and maybe you're right but you got to argue that the room

► 02:57:20

but this idea of these partisan patterns that people just seem to automatically fall into their so detrimental to dialogue or so detrimental to us under really understanding each other and it really having some sort of a sense of community right this is a giant community of 300 million people there supposed to be and this idea that it's this group is trying to fuck it up and they're trying to turn us all but this one wants everybody to be gay and this one wants everybody to fucking have free food in this and it's just this nonsense this is nonsense we need better understanding and let you know the word better education gets tossed around a lot but it also means better social understanding right better social education depreciation of who we are and why we think the way we think and calling out weasels on both sides of the pattern like calling out weasels on the right that are pandering they're just trying to like get up a repeating a lot of these like accepted believes they know that they can hit this frequency in a lot of

► 02:58:20

will sing along or the same thing that people are doing on the left to do it on both sides I think most reasonable people have a collection of ideas that they share from both the right and the left and most reasonable people are reasonably compassionate and I think that's one of things were missing some reasonable sense of not just athex but it appreciation for each other for all of us as a group and it did this. I think if we can celebrate reasonable conversations and celebrate an understanding of other people's perspectives be able to just look at how you're looking at things have empathy okay let me see where you coming from with this okay let me put myself in your shoes I guess I've just immediately like fuck you you suck and fuck you you this since instead of thinking about it that way if we just just try to just everybody exercise little bit more sore little bit more calm and come at this

► 02:59:20

from a rational place and try to like realize like an exclusion

► 02:59:26

I've been experimenting the very dangerous idea which is I keep hearing about Chief inclusion officers and I thought about something for me from Ecclesiastes you know. Every season there's a purpose under heaven so if there's inclusion they're also has to be exclusion and XD platform Iran platforming somebody is an active exclusion and very often three interesting that the people who are for inclusion are very focused on the need for deplatforming which is an active exclusion so shouldn't have Chief exclusion officers that both monitor who is being excluded including you know somebody like James D'Amore Google I guess it ethical to exclude him or are there certain voices that need to not be at some tables in order for something to make progress because you always have the voice that the most extreme that doesn't accept the game then it's very hard to move forward with in the game if you're constantly being reminded them so we we

► 03:00:26

series of situations in which it seems like some perspective that very few people hold terrorizes majorities or group of people who sort of can more or less get along with each other and keeps pushing us into this very divided landscape I was just curious you know in terms of our group of people that we talk and hang out with in common

► 03:00:55

where you see the high Leverage is that were we just finished the midterm we've got this 2020 election looks to me like Hillary is kind of iron whether she wants to get back in the game I'm this Trump thing has completely you know it's like it's like the dress is it black and blue or white and gold for I could be 8 years right and I just have you thought about How This Ends

► 03:01:24

well I would never be so presumptuous to think that I have any idea how this ends I have proposed various scenarios to myself and I don't like any of them I don't like where it's going cuz I would have worried about and this is also again hypocritical that cuz I think you probably should burn down and be rebuilt from the ruins when I would get such a clean things I know this isn't very clean either though honestly it's not clean clean you know the whole thing is weird it said that the bankers having the amount of influence they have the fact that there's two lobbyists what is it what's the number like to lobbyists to every member of Congress or to lobbyists every Saturday

► 03:02:13

for the pharmaceutical industry by the way the number of people that have influence over there with the way our laws are shaped it's it's so fucking bananas right now right so so off the rails so it is 12 but I didn't type it specifically but there's 23 registered lobbyist for every member from the pharmaceutical industry they were saying it's two for every member of Congress in the pharmaceutical industry yeah the question do you start out with like d platformer e people

► 03:02:46

I think we're impatient and I think we're where we really want to make sure that this wedding of ideas happens quickly because we see the answer we see the solution we we we see that this is incorrect and we see these people that think the world is flat are idiots and we think of these people that this I think this and think that we think they're all wrong and so we want to stop them from talking but that doesn't work it just works for now it did it often times feeds those ideas and it also you have to question like why are you so sure why are you so sure that you are correct that you want what you don't just want your side to be heard exclusively you want you want to silence these are the other people's ability to participate in this argument even if they're totally wrong

► 03:03:41

I think that's dangerous because I think that the way to fight off ideas that aren't good is to introduce ideas that are good and you're going to be going to have a bunch of people that agree with the idea that are bad but I think that that's a part of this whole figuring things out like you need to have bad ideas floating around there to appreciate good ideas of all the ideas are good like what do we do get it out against right it's not bad to have these bad ideas broadcast with bad to not have someone say hey these are bad idea it's okay Billy need to see the pitfalls of races we need to see the pitfalls of crime we need to see the pitfalls of corruption we need to see it in action I think it's like stock market swindling I think in a lot of ways it's important we need to understand that this is a pad in the people fall into continually over and over again when they have control over the money and they have control over their boobs in numbers what do I do this how do I tell you that this is going to go down and you invest some money and I put the money in your back and we work together let's make some money is what people do right they just fucking do it over and over and over

► 03:04:41

should you punish him yes absolutely but I think it's kind of important to see some fucked-up Behavior just too because we're not done we're still in some sort of emotional and psychological and even physical Evolution we're in the middle of this thing and I think that bad ideas facilitate comprehension like he's really shity ideas a lot of people have what they do think they pasilla Tater comprehension of why we think dumb shit and sometimes you don't know why people think dumb shit until you see someone over and over again that thinks dumb shit and you get to see that whether it's Alex Jones or whether to fill in the blank you want deeply but I don't want a lot of our leading experts deplatformed

► 03:05:27

okay well you're going deep for the spray paint fucking big a on Tucker Carlson's driveway aren't you what do you mean well

► 03:05:38

if I think about who the great danger is is it Alex Jones you know who views towards tinfoil hat land with some frequency or is it the people who are selling you no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq as a response to 9/11 at War you know the people let's assume that your reasonable person on immigration you neither think that border should be open or closed then you start hearing professors said he knows everything about immigration is is that it has absolutely no costs and all of them are better than all of our people because you know they're highly trained and highly motivated they're young you thinking like okay what kind of thing has all benefits and no costs ready you're not even entering into rational description and now we're hearing like all these trade deal that got negotiated yeah that kind of wasn't true all those things that we were telling you that if you if you question these things were backward protectionist and you were just stuck in the old world you could embrace the new yeah that was all

► 03:06:39

what I think is we have a crisis and expertise institutional expertise is at an all-time low nobody really trust any of our institutions to be an authoritative source of ground truth is not to say that

► 03:06:56

everything of the institution say is wrong or everything the experts say is wrong far from it it's just they're almost no experts are institutions that aren't willing to distort fax in order to pursue institutional goals that's a giant issue right right and so I don't actually want to be platform these people but I do have the very strong sense you know when it when I went you on came on your show and Peter teal my friend and boss came on Dave Rubin show I thought that was quite a moment where this alternate network of distribution which is not under centralized control started to be seen as comparably powerful and important and I think some of the noise is a Tucker Carlson just made to Dave Rubin about why you're doing this out of your garage and you have the freedom to do anything I'm I'm beholden to the structure in which I live a very interesting place with respect to what is this thing

► 03:07:56

this alternate distribution Network for infer ideas that's unpoliced by the institutions and you know I think I've been convinced in the last two days but I need this is advice that I got from you with the beginning you said you need to start a podcast I think I need to start a podcast I think you need to start a podcast just keep going on and on about the Hop thing till people figured it out. The hot thing but like you but we have to let me have to return to some kind of stable sanity that I'm positive that the institutions can't return us to because the institutional interests really have to do with the fact that certain kinds of growth on which there predicated their existence is predicated of evaporated so all of these institutions are extremely vulnerable to corruption at the moment and it was that the real Revolution is I'm seeing it is that high agency individuals are out competing traditional institutional structures

► 03:08:56

in terms of mine share and some of those agency individuals are irresponsible you know they're like Milo types that are kind of trying to light things up and some of them are extremely responsible and some of them and I will do if you are responsible things but will self correct and this new world that is being born is a huge check on the institutions but it's still largely separate like am I right that you don't do a lot of network television anymore but I used to I mean that's how I became famous in the first place right you know but yeah I don't do it anymore but it's also because there's nothing fun out there like this like this no place for this right other than this this is the only place I could do this but isn't it interesting to you that we are still have not like Jordan had to be dealt with by the mainstream because the book was too big his effect was too large

► 03:09:51

I think his effect on the Internet is bigger than the book I think the the YouTube videos and the debate city has the one I was telling you the recent one interview with GQ it's really good it's very smart but she gets trounced and it's because he's been in the trenches with this stuff for a long time I mean he he's he's fighting a very strange fight of dialogue of interpretation of discussion and and the freedom of intellectual sovereignty you know there's a lot of people that want you to think a very certain way and use certain words and say certain things and it doesn't matter whether or not you were in fact racist or sexist or homophobic or whatever it is a weird battle control going on that is at the heart of it as much as it is a battle of inclusion and diversity and strengthening our overall Progressive mindset is a little bit of that too but there's also an under

► 03:10:51

Bible game it's being played and people want to win the scores that are being scored his points on the board that's throwing in new agents their teams going at it and whenever Jordan goes on one of these conversations is video interviews in his a feminist and Jordan Peterson like there's a fucking game going on we're watching a soccer match or watching the wrestling match this is jujitsu playing intellectual Jujitsu and Jordans really good at tapping people he's really good at they get pissed they keep sending in new chicks

► 03:11:21

they said that Kathy Newman ladies like so what you're saying is that didn't work either she's got devastated she got rocked and this is what's happening over and over and over again because whether you appreciate what he saying or not he has some facts that are undeniable he has some positions that are based on a rich understanding of history and of Marxism and communism and of a lot of the problems with people with compelled thoughts if your compelling people to behave a certain way compelling people talk a certain way and we're not talking about you no compelling people did not commit crimes are violent we're talking about weird things like compelled pronouns and so I take if I take your analogy cuz you brought it up that he's like doing Jiu-Jitsu in some previous era and I thought your description of the early days of MMA was fascinating that we just didn't know what fighting was so we didn't know who would

► 03:12:21

winter what systems worked and if you think about the mainstream media is like

► 03:12:27

Aikido yes I'm system that maybe has some valid validity in some very rarefy context and it comes in to general purpose fighting systems and it's it's dismantled quickly so now we have this weird situation that we've got this new world of kind of rule Layton anything goes discussions more or less in the mainstream world doesn't want like the Aikido world doesn't want to acknowledge that this weird UFC type thing is happening how long does that go on it goes on for as long as it takes this is similar do I think the what's happening in Alachua Lee and this is one of the reasons why I don't think you should stop people from expressing his bad ideas is one thing stopping people say hey we need to kill black people stopping people that we need to kill white people we need to kill fill in the blank what are the group is yeah that's that's different clearly stepping outside of the realm of civilization

► 03:13:27

I'm in into war and violence and we could all collectively decided we should all collectively decide we should have athex together like weather is right or laughter in the middle we saw the side hey you can't do that because what you're doing is your you're calling for violence against someone who's not committing any Vine

► 03:13:47

let's assume that we know that that behavior needs to be down regulated in some way you can I can try to silence the person we just physically duct tape them so they can't say anything right you know that we put them in jail we won't go give them access to the media etcetera etcetera or we can shame them or we can kind of take them aside at what layer of the sort of communication stack two very good question we should because I think one of the things that we haven't done this to positively say we agree with you that the speech is offencive and it is potentially dangerous but we think it should be down regulated differently than the deplatforming option well the D platforming option the real issue is there's only a few different avenues for these people to express themselves publicly right and then the argument that's really strange it should these be regulated like a utility or should they be thought of his private businesses get to decide what's on their their Channel essentially like

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it's almost like a up a private NBC that everyone can broadcast on if it's none of the above what if the problems were trying to pretend is it like a dinner party is at the Public Square is it a utility and it's none of these things I think these ideas what I was discussing that you like this there's a reason why good ideas and bad idea should go to war is the same reason why even though I kind of knew that most Kung Fu was bullshit before the UFC I want those guys to get in there and try some deathtouch hey come on in orange juice YouTube guy you know this is his name is Cain Velasquez and are you going to try your deathtouch and now he's just going to wrestle you to the ground and beat your fucking brains in okay but that's not going to happen cuz you know. And you let them duke it out and that is the battle if you have ideas but it is a little platform people that's when it's not how I agree with you but what I'm trying to get at is that

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it is a I hadn't really thought about it the extent to which Jordan is the only one of us that they've really gone after like this well he's first of all he became famous from this right this is the battle was white how he emerged emerge from this battle over the use of compelled pronouns for various genders like the 78 different genders similar but not okay the difference is Brett's position

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he comes from a different place the way they were going at him so much more unreasonable they were saying right away that what he has to do is leave work because he's white they were basically saying a racist thing and everyone University of knowledge is racist except for the super lefties who thought that it made sense because in their mind every white person is somehow or another guilty of it least at the very least using your privilege to advance in the world at the to the negative impact of people of color in in people of other ethnicities so they decided that they are going to have a day of exclusion and instead of this day of absence having

► 03:17:13

black people and people of color stay home they're going to kick white people out so became aggressive act instead of an active appreciation I became an act of punishment or an act of exclusion and by people that are clearly out of their fucking mind that was also part of the problem is that they're arguing too incoherent you would see that fucking stupid president of the University standing in front of those kids and they told him to put his hands down because he was threatening through your you're scaring us you making violent gestures with your hand so he puts his hands down and they start laughing okay this is nonsense now you're a little kid get little kids running Lord of the Flies on a grand scale in a state university and it's all it means is that public university right I mean they get funding right this is all chaos nobody agrees they got baseball bat for looking for him if he's coming back to the school the kids form these vigilante groups with weapons over what a Google who's threatening you like what is happening and I need weapons the big story there was the non-reporting

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what do you mean well the New York Times Washington Post all of these major organs NPR they didn't want to touch the story well this is what what is my my big Theory here is that every outfit that has a a grand narrative cannot report the news that goes counter-narrative so racism by blacks against whites cannot be reported by any outfit that believe that racism is Impossible by blacks against whites there such a Preposterous position the idea that racism is exclusive to any group will the theory that all nations definition can suck a fat dick it's a stupid Redemption a true this idea that the only way you could be racist as if you have power over the other group that's nonsense every human beings act as individuals they always have power over each other give power to intimidate you have power to isolate you have power if you have more than one type of using about this is the

► 03:19:08

there is no pretense of consistency I mean on that side of the aisle it's like we're going to throw out the following 17 completely contradictory rules and then we'll tell you which rule is operative in any given moment so then I was going to throw out this concept of the Hilbert problems for social justice the one of them is you cannot understand me because my experience is two different and you must understand me because mine is so important right or we are all similar enough that any deviation from 50/50 shows you the amount of sexism in the workforce and we are all so different that once you include women in previous email occupations you will see a great benefit because of diversity of opinion what's right do you have to agree to well that's the weird thing is who assume that I just buy all of your stuff I think we made a terrible tactical error we fought these bad ideas

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rather than saying maybe we should just accept all of your bad ideas and then show you what kind of weird world they don't make sense you can't say oh yeah they make sense man how do I know when you're serious by showing the internal this is in in in mathematics we call this reductio ad absurdum that once you take on too many different points you show the conflicts showing that those things can't all be true there's no way in which I accept all of your ideas I can run anything so you know take this thing about that trans exclusion from Victoria's Secret

► 03:20:52

Rite Aid in your methods oh God so the idea that the Victoria's Secret lingerie division had had to step down where there was the scandal in the background that somebody had said we don't actually want trans people walking the Victoria's Secret runway

► 03:21:11

bright and Toad very interesting you have a company that is dedicated to the commercial exploitation of humans the sexual objects for the privilege of the male gaze and now you're angry that it doesn't include trans into that exploded class

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it's just without without getting into whether this makes like good economic sense or anything it's just the issue of self contradiction but isn't that a reduction in view of what Victoria's Secret isn't it possible that a woman can feel empowered and sexy if she's wearing lingerie and it's not just to the exploiting of the male gaze that it just date that she appreciates looking attractive wonderful so take that all day right exactly so the idea is that you're both going to say that that's a positive female empowerment issue and it's a terrible mail exploitations you at the same time every Mountain exploitation issued like what if a guy likes what if women decide University they like guys wear leopard skin underwear and Guy start wearing leopard skin tighty whitey underwear what is the sexual select but yes but what's the difference between dad and women wearing lingerie if with women wear lingerie and they do it because they like to be his dad and they like to be more trying that's what work to Xscape

► 03:22:27

all subjective vacation is an interesting issues that you write some point you made too many arguments there's this concept called the principle of explosion in mathematics the principle of explosion says if you can get one contradiction through airport security you can blow up the universe as soon as you allow a single contradiction in the unity of knowledge everything can be proven so everything becomes meaningless so the game in some sense in mathematics is frequently to say what was pick all of those beautiful things that you believe so you just enunciated some Ivan then see it it's time for the mall in instead of saying what's true and what isn't true

► 03:23:13

you say are these compatible and these ideas are clearly incompatible so for example one of the tricks that I use is to look at advertising for women to women and what phrases get used to if you use the phrase turn head this summer in quotes and put it into a search engine you'll find all sorts of revealing outfits that are intended to court the male gaze you said well maybe that's not really the male gaze let me put in a phrase like make him drool

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and that will be used to Market to women and so this issue about can we at least get to a point where were talking about the internal contradictions of your position like I don't even want to get into what my position is the first thing that's scaring me is that you said so many things so strong and so dogmatically and this doesn't have to be about gender to be about race that could be about class but once you said too many things then I can say look I don't see any way of squaring all of your positions and it's not it doesn't even have to do with me Brian I think that's where we haven't gone to yet so you think letting them come up with as many Preposterous things as possible and then once it gets to a position where they did the ideas contradict each other exposed that's my point which is once you've told me all of your principles okay

► 03:24:38

then I'm going to say great I'm confused do you feel that I have to understand you or that I can't understand you because I don't know which is operative in this situation tell me the rules how I decide which principle that you stated govern this situation right now I don't want to have to refer to you were you say while you were you bring me each individual situation and I will tell you which principles operative in which principle is inoperative that doesn't work I want you to list your principles and list your mechanisms for resolving the conflict within your principles and then once you've done that we can actually evaluate what you're saying but the moment it requires you as an oracle to tell me which of your many contradict you seemingly contradictory positions is operative in every particular case so for example we did we did that one with the person who is the Quantum

► 03:25:38

ex-muslim trans trans you know which is operative the person with Makayla phobia which is a extremely rare psychological condition or the person who appears to be deep into some self some radical self actualization pretty crazy makeup should be able to wear whatever they want is nothing wrong with that you should go to dress like Paul Stanley from kiss and yes you assume that that's true but what if for example is a heterosexual male you don't want to watch The Crying Game at the Victoria's Secret runway show do you really think that wait a minute do you really think that Victoria Secrets runway shows for the heterosexual male

► 03:26:24

in some sense yes what guys ever watch the Victoria Secret's there's something between a fantasy of it to Victoria Secret's a senior executive recently told Vogue that trans models don't be long in the fantasy the Victoria's Secret Fashion Show you know if that's that's on him when I don't mean he wants to be the bad just because he says it doesn't mean it's true I get if you if you look at the graph of male to female viewers of a Victoria's Secret I have no idea it would be like a few prepubescent boys and the vast majority of women and maybe some gay guys but that's it is that right what are you doing I'll get some popcorn ready for the Victoria Secret's Fashion Show dogs coming over Mike we're going to Jewel to TV. Fuck out of here is pouring and is everything else everything else is for chicks okay

► 03:27:24

runaway shit I don't know the single guy up there watching one-way shit it's like remember when Playboy had play girl that was for gay big Z they don't want to see that and we don't want to see runways when we're not here for one ways we get bored easy bunch of chicks walking around their underwear I think you're calling you may be right about who the audience is I have no idea on the demographics I've never watched one of these in my life but it's not the case that I believe that male the male gaze is nowhere to be found here because it's a very weird thing that the female is largely buying an amplifier for something that is supposed to excite email but it's it's a little bit to me like the female is the magician buying magic supplies at a store for the audience right that's a good way of looking at it I don't think the male gaze is absent I just don't buy his interpretation of that it's a fantasy

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perm and it's ruined with trans men are trans women I don't I don't have it since I don't have a dog in that fight seems silly it seems like you don't want transgender people to be in there you just have to say you can't say it ruin the fantasy you just say I will in like hiring people that have vaginas I don't know do whatever you want like it you could do certain jobs if you go to Chippendales like are trans women showing up a transman the other Chippendales where there was down there because you don't have a dick and but they're all jacked and they look like a man is this what women want to see and are they transphobic if they don't want to see that drive women go to do you know one of those all-male Revue shows and it's all trans man but they're heterosexual and then not really into transman are they all traffic I'm trying to get at is there's a hierarchy like I'm not that interested in this in the particulars of Victoria's Secret's profitability and went with their statements are but I'm more interested in is

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you've you've enunciated so many

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there's so many different principles at work as to what should govern in a conflict that you won't tell me well okay when these two things these two beautiful things that you've said actually lying in Conflict how do you resolve the conflict and it seems to be well why don't you consult us on every single one of these and will tell you in a case-by-case that can't work because what I want to know is I don't want to appoint you as an oracle I want you to stay with your positions are I want you to State how you harmonize them and then we're having a conversation but as long as I have to keep going to you and your crazy definitions and you're well this is operative on Alternate Tuesdays then it doesn't work I completely see your point however you can't give ground you can't give grounded nonsense cuz that grounds never get back you never getting it back if you allow them to establish certain ridiculous principles rules that are contradictory to each other they'll come up with the reason why they make sense no no you don't allow them to put it into the workforce you say look before weave

► 03:30:26

into the workforce let's just understand the 17 different things that you've said her absolute will you basically do and then what Jordan does and every single one of these debates you letting people lay out their idea and then you shoot him down and decide what's what's a logical and what's a logical I think that's that's the UFC of ideas right and this is why it's important to let the shity ideas into the mash why do we still have so much caught up in the Aikido league in the Kung Fu list because it sounds good people like the idea that you don't have to learn much you just go in there with a deathtouch fuck people up they don't want to think that all you have to practice for 10,000 hours you have to adjust bra and work on your leg kicks and we're so maybe just public shaming is deathtouch well debating these I think honestly and I'm not trying to blow Jordans Horan anymore than I already have but I think what he does is very important because he is one of the few that engages in these people in these very public forums

► 03:31:26

in these long-form debates where they go to war with ideas and either way better than theirs their conversations cuz cuz he's fucking good at it but I'm not as it's as like I'm not as combative is here so I said I'm also not as smart as he is and I'm also not as I'm not I don't have like when he is the University of Toronto Professor has PhD when he's going to war with these people they're they're throwing out Valliant Warriors who died his sword did you hear what happened to watch I would happen if you're down the stage for the first time and do they oppose each other oh yeah really on religion religious a sort of new atheist

► 03:32:23

that's right doesn't think that they religion is a virus this is not parasitizing the dirty believes that religion is actually an adaptation and the weird thing was his he said look there's a young Dawkins and there's old Dawkins and young Dawkins came up with these two powerful ideas the idea that the meme the unit of ideation is it is a gene like object he also came up with the idea of the extended phenotype so when you talked about that ant mound that you were Excavating that ant mound is in some sense part of the ant strategy it's such a deeply tide in that you have to consider the ant mound is part of the ant system because I can't exist without that complicated underground city right and so what he said was okay if I use these two concepts that memes are like jeans and the jeans can throw off a bad meme instantly soda

► 03:33:23

memes have to ride on a gene and they can't parasitize it too much and you also have this Inclusive fitness which is that maybe religion Co travel with us and allow us to out-compete those who don't have them because they seem to be found everywhere so prevalent that you have to if you look at it objectively not looked at it in terms of you know how you feel about cult-like behavior in the people's move susceptibility to influence if you just looked at it objectively they were From Another Dimension and you go will clearly this is a part of being a successful purse help me about exactly so Brea and docking met and I think Dawkins had this kind of reaction like oh crap I'm meeting an ultra darwinist who's read my work taking it seriously

► 03:34:11

and is feeding it back in and saying you you Richard Dawkins in your younger years established ideas who win that went Windows ideas logical consequences are explored it completely negates you're late life hatred for religion because it reveals it to be an adaptation rather than a pair of citizenship and of the human species you know what the real problem that I've always had with Dawkins and his take on religion is not that he's wrong there right it's his anger that he has when he's talking to people that believe yeah he he he sets he sets up the kind of like heavy conflict that you know the way people interact with each other is very divided the reactions are very dependent upon the attitude that a person has when they go into this interaction you know what you people meet on the street one person one person meets that person says the same words and they wind up hugging another person meet that person and has a

► 03:35:11

like what what is what's the difference what does a lot of it is the way you approach people the lot of is the way you accept people's ideas the way you communicate with them the way you allow them to fully Express themselves that judgment and he doesn't he doesn't buy any of that he feels like there's a war going on and he's got to shut down religion as quickly as possible that's the he wanted to wanted to Fashion science into a cudgel that was maximilia efficient for beating the crap out of her lid that's a great way to put end what bread did is to say actually your scientific work goes in the exact opposite direction the reason I brought it up was it was one of these unexpected occurrences that when you have a meeting of these things in this is your point about the UFC is that the Mixed Martial Arts is hey we don't know what's going to work we don't know what's going on with no nobody knows anything yet

► 03:36:03

and gradually we came to understand that there were certain systems that were hyper effective and that even those could get you know you work making the point earlier bed Brazilian jiu-jitsu didn't keep advancing at the same level once we understood the role of all of these different systems in advancing fighting so the question I'm having repeatedly is what kept Brett and docking for example from having that meeting where I think Dawkins probably didn't fully understand what he was getting into when he agreed to appear with an evolutionary theorist on stage what do you don't you think that is just very confident as ideas he's very confident as intellectual capabilities has been doing these type of debates and shutting down the secular P or these these people that are coming from various religions Ryan coming from he's he's had these debates with people from Judaism from Christianity views been part of his career right yeah I mean in even know what the fox's name

► 03:37:03

the Indian fellow who is named 2-2 yeah that guy that guys constantly using inappropriate Quantum words right throws Quantum into fucking vegetable soup and tries to make it to make sense he he use the word salad and I mean I've seen him to beat him to it mean there's just you like these videos of it the fake martial arts guys and they they show up for the challenge because they've actually bought it you want this is what I'm trying to get that isn't it interesting that in general the people who say you know immigration is a pure good there is no connection between Islam and Terror the only people who opposed free Trader protectionist these people know enough

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not to want to trance us

► 03:38:03

because what they're saying is is it is wrong right and they're expert enough to know that they are they got a secret five point you know exploding heart technique or something and they know it's nonsense it so they won't actually think they do well then why don't I don't think they want why don't they want in I don't think they I don't think they necessarily do actually believe that they're wrong I do think that some of these people that are like super aggressive and very very committed to some of these may be a logical position some of these ideas are afraid conflict though and I think that's one of the reasons why they shy towards progressivism towards socialism I don't think they like conflict some of them come out like to get together and scream at people together get together in large groups and say we know where you sleep you fucking braces you fucking piece of shit but one on one they're cowards okay it like this is this is the type of person that would think it's

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good idea to show up and bang on someone's when you scare them in their home that type of person is not the type of person that would looks forward to on an even Battlefield engaging some one-on-one and just just open communication that's not what they're doing what they're doing is trying to silence people scare people intimidate people their bullies intellectual boys people are bullies are almost always insecure they're almost always scared so this is why there's been very few people that are jumping forward to to try to go to intellectual War wit wouldn't it Rachel Maddow or Linda sarsour one in I mean they're pretty in time does we do deal with two very different types of human being so Rachel Maddow I was one thing Linda sarsour is a very very seriously religious person who's got some you know very deep beliefs as far as Islam she wears the head job but she means just as told two totally different things out of it but if I listed a group of people like the late night comedians does this very weird thing that they

► 03:40:03

all seem to believe the same but there was a secret meeting that they all agreed to a bunch of stuff that I I want to see the conference proceedings like how so they all kind of know that the Republicans are all horrible the Democrats are basically good people that they they all know that climate science is settled science I mean there's some that they have these pretty much open borders are great thing and that everybody who doesn't believe in that is only so it is only not believing it because of xenophobia whatever these set of beliefs are I don't see these guys in open discussion particularly in a 2 hours long Stephen Colbert Seth Meyers

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in here and have a discussion my guests are really I'm sure I'm sure I'm sure they doing some of your scared of having discussions people but I only see them to be very measured because I can lose their job it's not it's not that simple like they make a tremendous amount of money if they came and said anything that could be misconstrued or misinterpreted even not even actually being something it's actually transphobic or actually a homophobic or actually xenophobic if they said anything that could be taken out of context and put in a small clip and then sent out and when it goes viral hair done look at Megyn Kelly Megyn Kelly had a question about why can't you wear makeup to look like Diana Ross why can't you what are some good reasons why you can't or some good racial history behind black face however why is it that she can't even ask a question without losing her job like that's it

► 03:41:53

pull up plug if we have to make a fucking statement that we a bore violence what do you have or write me what you said about about the whole Kung Fu thing that is only can exist in a protected context well first of all someone like Megyn Kelly can only exist in a protected contest with all these people protected contest Stephen Colbert is like got to be one of the fastest mines on the planet that everybody I know smarter than his shows has he just thinks faster than you do know I'm sure he's very smart guy. But there's also a Catholic this bother me cause me doesn't bother me all those kids getting fucked

► 03:42:38

well that's if your a Catholic like I was raised Catholic I mean I'm not saying that he is I'm not saying that the people he knows our but this is a giant problem with that organization but that's no it's not bothering me but not bothered with jets

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I want to make sure that we were talking but they were about to talk past each other so when I get back okay

► 03:43:00

I think you just gave me an answer. He can't appear in this kind of a context because that might come up

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and hit he needs to be in a world with much more restricted rules where someone can't say it's an organization kid fucker that's right yeah more restricted were the reason why that has been able to survive but I'm pretty sure that don't talk about is the idea that this is such a like your point about Aikido was if you happen to be unarmed and attacked by a man with a sword this might have some value it would have some value of someone to attack you in a very specific way I didn't understand a piece of the ideas that that's a very restricted rules on which to fight so now maybe what you just said to me which could open this whole thing up is that all of these people can only apply their ability to

► 03:43:55

have a back-and-forth of ideas if the rules are heavily restricted I don't necessarily think that's the case I think they could do it in other ways I think all of them are operating under this rule system because it's real system is how they get paid but I think Seth Meyers a very smart guy I know Jimmy Kimmel he's a very smart guy they can do whatever they want he could do a podcast he could do anything he could operate into any in any genre I believe I think I would imagine the same with Colbert I mean I think Jimmy Fallon same thing but when they're forced into that box and this is a hundred million dollar your box you know it feels good in that box is fucking velvet walls and get to drive a fat Mercedes and live in Beverly Hills 22222 you decide to stay in that box right maybe their mind is in that box maybe they operate on a regular basis maybe there's not any restriction for them at all because this is how they operate all the time so I did the show with the Jordan and Ben Shapiro on Dave's set

► 03:44:55

right before Ben went on Real Time with Bill Maher and Ben was kind of excited to do Bill Maher and said I don't think he's going to rough me up but you know I think he's going to be a gentleman if he's one of us and they wouldn't been set down with Bill we saw this thing that was very we were sort of hoping because Bill is kind of the most towards us of anybody in that kind of mainstream environment when I song which I had really appreciated was the bill was not doing this kind of open discussion thing a lot of his tone was leading like surely you're not going to say that you know it wasn't just purely saying are you saying that it was all of this emotional instruction yes and it and it was clear that to me that when I saw it been on that in that context that there were only a few hours separating the two appearances and that the characteristics of that environment and we're bills show is the most liked this show

► 03:45:56

it's just too different. It's not really the same ecosystem and you couldn't have an open debate unless it cuts off after 7 minutes and the host is in control will tell doesn't have any time that's well this is part of the problem they are the terms of they have a very restricted format he was doing a conversation with the Steve Bannon and he was on Sam Harris podcast he was talking about it you said the one of the problems was she got to this point or is like I was I want to ask more stuff but I ran out of time and I heard that I was like what the fuck kind of ancient system are you operating under that you run out of time let's take it was take his word he definitely did run out of time but assume that that's true it's only Bill Maher said hey guys I want to I want the following situation I want to continue to do real time in the same format that it's always been done but I want to have a podcast like broken where we take as much time as we need and I don't think those two things play together though they're fine together yeah I think they're chewing together I had a bigger than that they're not well here's the thing he went on sale

► 03:46:56

podcast and I've I enjoyed him more than I enjoy him on the show I know cuz he had chances and look the same way on Dave Rubin show though I didn't say it oh my God you got to see it you know Tucker you not having my own weird issues where I used to you know my previous position was that Fox News is just propaganda in the Tucker was in that old Crossfire situation way back when Tucker was like opening up as a different person saying you have the freedom you're the new I'm still stuck in the old why you must really feel that you must really feel like he is look up that is what you have to do if you want to survive on Fox News and again it's a velvet coffin you're in there it's beautiful as you're getting paid shitloads of money but you don't necessarily have the freedom to express pros but you don't have long form. Write and you don't have the freedom to completely Express Yourself across the border like you could you can't look at the website ideas

► 03:47:56

you know what I really like the idea of Universal Health Care I really like the idea of universal basic income I really don't like the idea of paying for people's School joke I think you and I actually have a really interesting difference of opinion I think your opinion is there's nothing preventing you from staying in the Velvet coffin and doing this style of podcast and my guess I think I'm talk across and left Colbert dude yes I don't think so I think he could I don't think he would though I think he out of all of them and I think he's brilliant don't get me wrong I want an organization of kid Fockers it's not him I mean but he's a part of the cabbie could you set my you could do any one of these people they're all bright and Melody of the organization and what they've done to protect people that have molested children it's unprecedented right it's also something that I was raised in and I was Catholic I went to Catholic School

► 03:48:54

I don't think that he wants to do that sort of Wild Country open type internet show I think he enjoys wearing a tie and doing a straight-up talk show like the Johnny Carson show or the Jay Leno show and I think he's a very very good at it and I don't think it's anything wrong with that I think a lot of people like that that's why I'm a prince and I understand that I think that's him I might be wrong I'm just assuming there's a drug dinner at you different that if you try to do both of these things you would be revealed you be caught between two worlds

► 03:49:29

if like I actually think that a lot of these ideas would collapse just the way Kung Fu collapsed I think you're probably right I think if you had two people having these conversations and long-form instead of those CNN three Windows where is battling it out for 6 minutes and then that the you know everybody's yelling over everybody that is the single worst way to argue ideas I think there's no Gracie challenge there's not well Jordan Peterson is kind of doing his own drinks that challenged it because some people under yeah and it's he's the only one they want yes well it was just it was just I think it was always crazy of the intellectual a place where is yeah I mean I think

► 03:50:20

Nollywood Jenna mately now he's worked his way past the kung fu people and he's now on to like Olympic wrestlers I said throwing at him this this latest one was very good yeah she's much better than that Kathy Newman lady she didn't make any of these ridiculous straw man arguments she came out I'm with her positions and their points was interesting I think what you're saying is true for everybody except Bill Maher I think Bill Maher would hold his positions in podcast form and I think you would just have more time to expand on them and I based this on him being on Sam Harris a show and I find it to be very good it was the 10th anniversary of Religulous and he was excellent on there I think he could do it but I think he's also he can say fuck you he got in trouble for dropping an end bomb on his show and in a joking form and he's a different cat the whole thing is very different with him is on HBO but when Ice Cube came to him and said you can't do that it was painful to me because I was positive that he had Carlin style out of

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what about that word

► 03:51:22

that's tough because in this environment again that's where he makes his living He Butters is bread over at HBO and if you wanted to have a long form conversation with that guy even on a podcast on and he didn't have an HBO show that's one thing but if you have an HBO show you have totally different attitude because one wrong you're walking a guy being a tightrope but this is what I'm trying to get at is the weird too dangerous and some sense to play with because the Velvet she's exhausted we talked and I actually went back and forth on an email about something I dropped the ball but now he would do any buddies podcast I don't think that's the case he could do his own podcast as well I agree that he would be the one most likely to be able to do both he could do it he could do it I think all of them could do it I think Seth Meyers could do it too I think Jimmy Kimmel could probably do it as good or better than any of them Jimmy absolutely could do it I mean the only thing that's holding him that we can he's a man of his ideas he's not going to he's probably the least likely to

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alter or manipulate his ideas of anybody that's ever done one of those late night talk show host he's just operating inside of format we don't swear and give a certain amount of time and you try to be funny and you say inside. But he's a very ethical guy and he's also very very smart guy and he's also very rich he's got a shitload of fuck you money for and I think Jimmy Kimmel could do it easily I think a lot of people could do it easily and I think they're going to have to I think some some point along the line they're going to realize that the restrictions that they're operating under unless they really enjoy that format don't think those formats are going to be there that long I think those formats are a lot like sitcoms like they're slowly starting to vanish you know for everyone the Roseanne show that comes up which is kind of nostalgic and you know that runs into its own disaster right how many new sitcoms are there that everybody's aware of shit I used to be every time there was a new sitcom where was friends or you know fill in the blank whatever the show Seinfeld it was everybody was talking about these new sitcom right nobody fucking talks about sitcoms anymore this is

► 03:53:22

yeah this is at the thing I I took on this morning on Twitter which was Dave Rubin and Bret Weinstein myself were talking about this phenomena of

► 03:53:35

very high fall or accounts with psycholo engagement oh yeah that's fake that's those are fake followers that's what that it may be but it's a lot of it but it's very interesting that were talking about getting rid of visible follow accounts and getting rid of likes apparently there was discussion about Jack May floated some trial balloons that Twitter is going to try to improve the level of conversation by getting rid of follower count and removing lice imagine thinking you going to improve the level of conversation by getting rid of a heart that you would put on someone's IDR if it's literally a heart but it's feed that you're clicking on a heart it's on Instagram and on Twitter it's a heart it's a like

► 03:54:18

picture of the heart I love you going to get rid of love Jack come on Jack going to get rid of love terrifying you would be blowing kisses in my general direction I'm remembering all the videos I've watched where you a text I'm sort of a punching bag with his vicious spinning elbow or something I just think think okay we're talking about ideas here you can not want to get down on that stuff later when I'm a midlife crisis sick with with some instructions I think we're okay we've done four hours and 10 this is there we've been saying for a while we are rethinking everything about the service to ensure we are incentivizing healthy conversation that includes the like button we are in the early stages of the work and have no plans to share right now

► 03:55:11

this is in response to Telegraph the telegraph saying Twitter to remove the like to win the bid to improve the quality of the bank I think something really weird is going on I mean what is the quality of debating by whose definition I mean you're definitely not going to change the way people interact with each other you just not people interact with each other because they're Anonymous they have the incentive to talk shit it's fun okay so the one thing I could ask who it as we close this thing out is if we could plug not only my Twitter which is my main thing but I'm trying to diversify the Instagram and YouTube should I get shut off Twitter and shut off but you don't say anything inflammatory like would you you're very logical and reasonable guy

► 03:55:53

so you think it's really gotten to that point I'm actually worried that by being logical and reasonable I have more of a risk because the things that I'm saying I can also recognize intellectual and very left-wing your Progressive yeah so why would they shut you off I think because they're much more worried about a progressive it says that the current progressiveness is absolute stupidity is much more dangerous than some right-wingers always against anything's Progressive interesting there's a war foot you love that kind of stuff you love that Cloak and Dagger type shit don't you get one part of the effectual door

► 03:56:30

watch your stuff I don't see any factual I say is actually I can't call myself a part of the dark web that's just too ridiculous from man of my position okay we'll see you at the someone of that lady 1,000 people that speak the humor across the the lands listen this is yeah I can do for hours but please do

► 03:57:06

I think I am

► 03:57:10

Camellias 5-10 she's Eric Weinstein PhD I think on Instagram and on my Instagram

► 03:57:24

I linked you on the Instagram Instagram and I'm on YouTube Eric Weinstein PhD you my friend lots of fun Alright by you fux

► 03:57:41

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► 03:58:53

you didn't that's it we did it again ladies and gentlemen thank you for tuning in appreciate you all much love to you all.